One of those is “harder” to achieve.
Which may or may NOT be the same level of difficulty.
Having tried with cannabinoids, and understanding that there are spatially and morphologically distinct subtypes, it makes sense to me that getting 80% of the cannabinoids is a different task depending on the starting cannabinoid content.
No, he’s saying you need to give actual fucking numbers and data in order to get a real answer to your situation. Aside from that, you’re just hoping that your intuition and experience is guiding you in the right direction. Real talk, it probably is guiding you in the right direction 90% of the time but without objective numbers you really don’t know.
By all means, keep doing what you’ve been doing and you’ll get what you’ve always gotten. Don’t get salty if you get left behind by an industry that is quickly requiring more than just “working fine” to remain competitive.
You are saying a LOT of incorrect things. So that is not the case…
What I know is the Luna allows me to attempt to teach dense people on the internet basic extraction math all while the system is running unattended and allows my two technicians time for analytics, post processing and r&d time which would not be possible in the same way it would be with a manual system.
Most people running a bizzy bee have one high level paid operator and an assistant (sometimes two) that do all of the tedious tasks required to load and unload a traditional manual system and keep it running during a shift.
I can have one tech spend about an hour packing bags for a days worth of runs and at most another hour (throughout the whole day) doing pours, material swaps and crc swaps.
Thats roughly 2 hours of labor for one person to run an 8 hour shift on the luna.
the other 6 hours they can be post processing, running analytics (since we do all that in house) and all the various other projects in the lab going on. that’s ONE person.
Now go to the manual system of choice and you have 2 people at 6-8 hours a day working to keep that system operating. That’s 12-16 hours of labor.
10-14 hours a day more than than the luna requires. that adds up FAST!
just for fun lets do a year calculation without any payroll taxes to make it simple and easy. (days in a week 5 x hours in a day 8 x weeks in a year 52= 2080 total hours)
Luna operator $20/ hour
(days in a week 5 x labor hours in a day 2 x weeks in a year 52= 520 total hours of labor in a year)
520x20=$10,400 of labor to run the luna for a YEAR!
Comparable manual system with just 1 operator $30 an hour. (that’s one badass operator)
(days in a week 5 x hours in a day 8 x weeks in a year 52= 2080 total hours)
2080x30=$62400 of labor a year to run a manual system.
that is $52000 more in labor i would spend on running a manual system with one operator.
more realistic manual system two operators one at $30 an hour and the assistant is at lets say $15 which equals $45 and hour
(days in a week 5 x labor hours in a day 8(x2 operators) x weeks in a year 52= 4160 total hours)
2080x30=$62400 of labor a year to run a manual system.
4160x45=$187,200 of labor in a year to run a manual system with two operators.
that is 176,800 more in labor i would spend on running a manual system with two operators.
I mean, I don’t think anyone is disagreeing that it’s automated and can save you labor money. But let’s do some more quick math. Bizzy bee sells a machine for around 400k that does like 2-300 lbs a shift right? So you get 20-30 lbs of oil maybe even 45 with the two operators. You do in a day with two or three employees what the lunatec takes a week to do. Even at bottom dollar bm prices of day 1000, you can make 20-45k worth of product a day or 7500. Which one will pay off faster at 400k per unit?
We can run ~1000# a week of FF with our Luna not even trying hard on one shift.
I’m going to leave this here.
Makes sense.
You guys use yours for adult use cannabis yes?
Is most of your material closer to 8% or 25%
Actually the comparable throughput bzb was 70k less than a luna. Which is exactly why I made the choice to go with automation.
the cost difference in a year of labor paid for the price difference. EASILY.
I’m just curious did you miss the part where i said i have in house analytics? because i can assure you im making all my decisions with math, and numbers and all my available data and if the bzb was the better option i would have gotten it. I dont just calculate labor i also calculate throughput, extracts made, and extracts left behind, ease of processing, the list really goes on and on.
But if i made a bad choice i would gladly sit here and talk about it, and improve myself in the process. the last thing i want to do is guide my community to a bad choice or a system that doesnt do what they want or expect.
Yes, Oregon Rec market
Our input ranges from 5% fan leaves to up to 30% buds. With the majority being 15-20%
I’m right here, geeeez. Hahahaha jk
I love you too, and your output product goals are vastly different than mine, you have quality at the top of the mind, your input material is primo, the majority of mine is mids and im trying to run a factory. 
It was just too perfect to make a joke. And I even agree, that it would be pretty sweet to only have to attend the machine for 5-10 min per hour and have the rest of the time for activities
And I think it would be pretty cool to see if one could incorporate the Luna and the illuminated machine together for them to automate together. That ish would be snazzy
Well idk what to tell you. There’s better options than lunatec. Yeah we have an hplc where I am now. Glad you have numbers, most people have access to testing these days so idk why that’s even brought up.
Glad you like it, I personally don’t. The machine I’m selling on this thread runs and recovers 40 lbs of biomass in 30 mins. 15 if it’s just for crude. Only 250k. Illuminated extractors makes one that does 300-400 lbs a shift for 400 if I remember right. Bizzy bee makes good systems for right around there. Idk when you bought your Luna but I know someone running a bizzybee ffe right now that paid about 400k for everything. Lunatech advertises 150 lbs per shift and it’s just not true. I ran one for about 6 months, didn’t like it. The machine also doesn’t load and unload itself so someone still has to be there to change it out every hour and set the program. Idk where you think you can get 500 hours of labor in a year to get it to operate that capacity. Maybe you mean you work there and don’t take a salary but that’s still a labor cost if you’re not there so idk. I stand by what I said.
Really? thats weird because every single other lab i have every gone into in the past two years only one other lab had analytics.
you are selling an extractor on this thread?
please elaborate on that statement , how would going to crude warrant a shorter time?
yeah loading and unloading takes no more than 5 minutes… and set the program? We literally just unload the material, reload the new material and press start run and walk away.
Well if you read my post you would understand where those numbers came from. But here since reading isnt your strong suit i’ll quote it again.
Well idk what to say. I’ve been to several labs that have hplc
Crude warrants a shorter time because you don’t have to send solvent solution through a media blend which restricts the flow to the ffe.
And yeah, I get that’s how the Luna works. So what? You have someone come in every hour and pay them for five mins? Because you still need someone there to make sure everything’s working good. And like I said, even if it’s you doing the work and it’s free to you that’s not going t to be the situation for everyone. The two labs I know running a Luna have full time bag packers and full time extractors. Idk why you’re trying to act like it runs itself lol
Well, it pretty much does. Isn’t that the whole point of automation?! There’s only 3.5 of us here, and the minimal attention Luna needs allows us to each be primarily focused on different tasks/projects (analytics, distillation, ethanol extraction, pesticide remediation, bulk packaging, cart filling, etc, etc, etc). I’ve not seen a lab able to run as efficiently as we do, and that is a testament to the machine we’re running (as well as the badass crew we have).
I wasn’t speaking on the automation standpoint. The context of the statement was that his hour per year projection is skewed because you still need people there to switch out bags and run the machine.
I know there’s plenty of people that dumped 400k into a Luna and love to throw around the amount labor is saving them and ignore the fact that it’s lack of throughput compared to other machines for the same price far outpaces what they’ll save in labor but as I said, glad you all are happy. I stand by what I said.
I love the fact that it eliminates a bunch of mundane labor. No standing and staring and watching and waiting and turning valves at the right time, etc.
My main operator is on vacation and I grabbed one of my lab techs and he and I ran 180 lb of fresh frozen yesterday from 8-3.
We just dicked off most of the day, made a badass lunch, smoked a bunch of weed on our breaks, I took some meetings and phone calls and we were done by 4.
How is it skewed? You just literally suck at reading comprehension. Do I really need to quote my post again?
When someone isnt attending to the luna they are still here working on other tasks that make the labs money from other avenues. My post pretty clearly said on average the luna only needs to be attended to for 2 hours a day. The other 6 hours can be spent on tasks that do not involve the luna at all. and attending to the luna throughout the day consists of waiting for the green light to flash so we can pour or swap bags. That is literally it.
How long ago was the luna you ran built? what lab was it at Tos Mos? ? I’d wager you are talking shit about a system that has been vastly redesigned and improved multiple times.