The pics below are some examples of what I would expect the compressor package to look like on a single stage refrigeration system of a butane extraction system. These are outdoor units and even though they look expensive they’re not that bad especially compared to what people are forking over to Huber.
Keep in mind, a company like Huber that only makes fully enclosed scientific chillers would be much quicker to switch to the more complicated cascade type versus just upsizing the r404a components to get large heat removal capacities because they need to cram everything into that small rolling frame and that’s much easier with a cascade type. Like I have said, you pay a huge premium to have them engineer everything to fit in that small case.
Also, I think some people don’t really understand what it means for Hubers to have a rated temperature stability of plus or minus .01C. That is incredible precise and you pay a lot of money for it on top of the money you pay to have everything crammed in the small case. That’s what the Unistat operating principle is all about: precise temp control. This is why it took Bizzy hours to cool a rack of jacketed tubes to -70C with a 915w and 10ton glycol chiller.
Do you guys see what I mean about how all this other split refrigeration equipment has been available for years but because it’s not wrapped up in a nice bow with a pot leaf on it and sold at a trade show I guess people would prefer to severely over pay Huber and Bizzybee?
It really is highway robbery Bizzy is committing each time he sells a 915w/CS100 combination to one of you. IMO you people who have paid for this should be pissed. You have been taken advantage of. There has been so much time for Bizzy to sort this out but I’ll bet he takes a huge cut on each Huber he sells so he hasn’t taken it to the next step like Bhogart.
How do you guys feel with your overpriced, underperforming Hubers while Bizzy constantly talks about baller dinners and partying? Isn’t he almost 50? Maybe he’ll let ya come hang out at his new house he’s buying in Hawaii with all your money.
Does anyone remember that little phase he went through recently trying to convince Precision to buy him out and sell his equipment after he talked so much shit about them? Then all the talk of being a crypto asset manager or trader? I mean this guy is basically a self-described LARPer in this industry who’s just here taking your money at this point. Not that it really matters but does the guy even dab oil?
I agree totally, -40C is really the dividing line IMO for single stage. If you really actually need the process fluid to approach that, you’ll want to switch at least to a two-stage single refrigerant system if not cascade.
I also agree that it’s ridiculous that people spend so much money on an ultra precise chiller and then come post here and don’t even have a good method for measuring their process temperature. Also, the vast majority of shutdowns IME are related to automation parts or diagnostics that aren’t mission critical. Chillers should be like Toyota pickup trucks: nothing should break but if it does, it shouldn’t necessarily stop the thing from running. These Huber units are more like a GTR that won’t start because there’s air in the tires instead of nitrogen
@Tech1145 Wanted to give you an update. I have had the system up and running for over a month now and the Hubers work great.
Are they overpriced? 1000%! But, I have yet to run another system like it. I would love to set up demos of the system you are describing to see if it would recover as fast (3-4 lbs a minute) at temps below -50C. And to see how it would handle a heavy mixed solvent load. It sounds like it would do just fine but when it comes to spending say 100 vs 200k and there is a risk of the 100k option not coming out right then id rather spend the 200 and lock it a sure thing. It may sound crazy but spending even 50k if the equipment doesn’t work properly is a complete waste.
The whole reason we get charged so much is because they know we can pump out 6-10k grams out in one shift. haha The truth is if you can sell the product these things pay for themselves the first month.
When I first made this post I was barely up and running. I just had been hearing rumors through the grapevine that my huber cs100 may not be enough to properly back the 915. The only time the cs100 trouble is after turning them off for a day. The CS takes 1-2 hours to really work down the 915 without overheating the next morning after a shut down. Once they get to temp they are both holding great.
Cryodax is high grade.
I agree with the -30c as well as the freezing the column jackets.
I’ve had nothing but problems with every Huber product I’ve owned.
At one point had 5 broken units.
All to the dump they went lol
Joking aside, I’m always happy to help troubleshoot. It’s my dream that one day my company will allow me to buy something that isn’t broken when it arrives, but it’s trained me up pretty well lol. @The_Lone_Stiller I appreciate the vote of confidence.
The Huber’s are very reliable and precise, which are two things you need when setting up a process design for the lab especially in a licensed setting because as part of QA they need to ensure the SOP is followed to a T every time, that includes temp set points and anything that is different is considered a deviation and must be documented, and who wants to waste time on extra paperwork?
OP has the option of actually running their 915w off a water rack coming into the building, the con to that is the constant waster drainage/waste … if you have a body of water near by you can circulate from and it usually stays around 10c than you can make due (I only recommend this if said water is treated/clean enough for the pretentious internal materials used in the Hubers) but if you want the 915w to service below -40c, you’d definitely need an AC circulator running that because now your talking about needing 9-5c temp consistently on water side and of course the go to would be to have an outdoor unit.
When we get to -40c and beyond you start to generate a lot of heat rejection, granted once you get to the target setpoint the water coolers usually tone down a bit and don’t create significant heat rejection but its the initial demand when starting out at RT that makes soo much heat rejection, and the goal is to move it outside. Unfortunately alot of designs are not like this and often times you see significant HVAC refrigeration requirements as a result.
My two cents overall, Huber’s are expensive, Bizzy is expensie, ROI capable? yes? most efficient, maybe not but its reliable, and a quick go to, and a lot of these companies are okay with paying the higher price for better capability and hassle free setup, do they always get that? Sadly, no. They should, its just unfortunate sometimes and I know there have been folks who’ve been sold a dream in the past. As the years go on, the prospect is that will becomes less and less of a thing, hopefully…
Sorry to dredge up old comments. But based on this I could get away with only chilling my solvent columns in order to recover and could just use speed/ pre chilling columns in dry ice to make sure my fresh frozen material stays cold? If I’m running a very small system could I get away with using a poly sci recirculating chiller to chill my columns? Sorry if this is a dumb question…
Just trying to get a rough real world idea of what kinda of condensing power / “recovery” one can expect with a CS-200 in terms of Lbs per minute of N-Butane. thx
