Low yields on a fairly large, bad ass setup

Help Support and Requests
1

Hey y’all, first time poster long time lurker.

Gonna be a dump here so, please bare with me.

Had a opportunity last year to build a machine to run a little over 3000 pounds at a lions share split. Went from a single 6x48 and 12" collection pot, 2 trs’s a nitro tank to hand building myself a rack mounted system holding 4 6x48 a 100# sol tank, a 12x48 jacketed collection pot and a bunch of other shit.

Here’s the rub, yield!!! I ran this machine for 2 months straight, 100# of material a day, had 12-15% material and yielded an average of 8-9% consistently. Back then, quality, stability, yield and color wasnt an issue because I wasn’t paying for the material, the final product was pre soldand the machine kicked out roughly 40 to 45# finished product a week.

I have since taken the machine and my profits and have set up for myself. Buying material at $18 to $40 per thats purpl tested at minimum of 14% to an average of 18% to a high of 22 to 24%.

Still grinding away at my 12 tubes a day (100#) but…again, here’s the rub…yield!!! No matter what I do I get 8 to 9% across the board. Meaning 22% in and 9% out or 14% in and 8% out. I know, right, hard to believe!!! Its true.

This big bitch costs about 22k a week to run. 16k per week for material and another 6 to 7k a week for gas and ice. With 40# a week finished, 3% increase in yield is massive!!! I want and need to find that 3 to 8% im not getting.

Machine.
14 6x48 columns rack holds 4 at a time.
3/8 injection
100’ 3/8 injection coil ice and iso i know, there’s better options but, old dog, new trick. I get -80 so who cares.

Shower heads on each column.
6" filter plates and bowl reducers on each column.

12x48 jacketed collection pot, pour/squirt out the bottom.

8 gal a minute, propane, way far away on demand water heater. 80% of the time I have liquid in my pot I am running at 140 degrees water temp. If you think that’s too hot, it’s not. Thats how I get 3 lbs a minute recovery…passively!!! Yeah, 3 lbs a minute, PASSIVE. The liquid in the pot is butt ass cold, it doesn’t even know its 140 all around it until its 75% drained and i shut off pump in order to not risk burning product. And again, yeah…3lbs a minute passive!! Ask me how, ill happily explain. 1" recovery line is a solid hint. The water heater is the rest of it. I only use passive and 3 trs21 for my hot loop. Yeah, its quiet in my shop. Ha. My passive is so damn fast I have to stop recovery mid run to make sure I have enough gas in the pot to hot loop. This is all how I can run 100# per day, just me and a tube packer in a 7 hour day.

2 100# solvent tanks. One dedicated to inject, one dedicated to recovery and I move gas back and forth all day long. Recovery tank is always left open to a vent outside. Since every drop of gas that goes in has been through 100’ of 1/2" coil its cold as shit and not a drop of gas is lost. For that matter, once the system is primed and cold, the tank is always in a vacuum. Again, 140 degree water, 1" line and 100’ of coil…3 pounds a minute recovery with no pumps!!! Ask me about this, it works, ill help.

I feel myself getting off track here, sorry.

Process:

I dehue the shit outta my material using heaters, fans and 2 dehumidifier for 24 hours.

I grind all my material in a 10 gallon trim sumtn preroll grinder. 15 seconds for a 5 gallon bucket all but gets the material to dust. Yeah this screws up color but, crc takes place down stream so it’s not an issue.

Hard pack, 9.5# per tube. Light pack, 7.5# per tube, no yield difference what so ever, still 9%.

I fill 2 tubes at a time. Takes 25# to fill the tube under 60 psi nitro. I open to the pot barely and I shove another 10# over the top. With valve to pot barely cracked, I am positive the additional 10# of gas is more or less pushing a solid slug of liquid from top to bottom. I run the additional 10# through, shut off inlet and outlet and do the same thing with tube number 2. Once 10 additional has been added to each for a total of 35, which is roughly 4:1, I then throw 60 psi nitro over the top of both tubes and sit on the couch, yeah, there’s a couch in the shop, I then sit on the couch and slowly wait for the 70# to drizzle into the pot. I then fire up the trs’s, loop outta the pot to defrost my columns and push out the last bit of liquid.

Short of a bunch of other obvious shit, thats the nuts and bolts.

So, I inline crc down stream. My thought was the crc was slowing down the way the gas flows through the tuba and the system that I have been not crc’ing to take that outta my equation and nope, no difference. Still 9% yields on 24% material.

I have tried 60# of gas and no change.
I have tried 20# of gas and no change.
I tried more or less open blasting, no soak, just run straight through, no change.
I tried light pack of tubes, no change.
I tried no grind, light pack, no change.
I tried no grind heavy pack, yep, no change.
I tried prayer, yep, still no change.

The only thing I can think of is, channeling. I have shower heads but, maybe still channeling?
I tried a filter plate at the top under shower head, yep, no change.

The only thing I haven’t tried is BOTTOM FILLING and then topping off from the top and pushing the slug slow like I have said before

I am trying this tomorrow…I assume, no change. Lol

Oh, let’s add this…ugh!!! If you rerun a tube, same way and process, yeah, 100 to 150g per tube. Math an that, 10 tubes a day, 100 to 150 per…that’s 3 pounds of product thats being left on the damn table. Well, it must be under the damn table because I can’t seem to find it. And no, I can’t or won’t run tubes twice to get that out. There has to be something im missing that is fixable to get those 5 to 10% that im leaving behind.

Sorry for the sloppy post but, thank you in advance for ANY AND ALL HELP!!!

IM SURE I MISSED SOMETHING, ITS LATE AND I E RAN THROUGH 2000# IN THE LAST MONTH AND I HAVE LOST AT LEAST 80 TO 100# OF FINISHED PRODUCT. UGH, see told ya im tired, missed the caps locks there

Ask away. I’ll happily answer. I have built and ran a beast for over a year now but, this last issue will make or break me.

Where the hell is my oil?? I know where it is, its getting left in the tube, why???

Thank you!

Oh yeah, isolated room, multiple explosion proof fans, gas detectors and all the smart shit

Bad, very bad pictures…I’ll take some more in the am.

20200925_110026
20200925_1100264032×3024 3.54 MB
20200925_110043
20200925_1100434032×3024 3.71 MB

Old pics. 2" recovery port and 1" line added to collection pot.

2 Likes
2

What solvent are you using? Butane, isobutane, propane?

4 Likes
3

Bottom feed and soak may help

3 Likes
4

Socks or no socks for biomass ?
Found out that some socks made from PP channel a lot more than socks made from
PEEk

1 Like
5

If it’s hitting the same point all the time maybe your solvent is saturated. Have you tried upping your solvent volumes?

1 Like
6

I dont know much compared to most the guys that will answer but did I read that your basically doing a 4:1 ratio at most for your solvent?

I dont know how much it would change the outcome but from what I’ve learned on here you want it higher especially when your using crc right?

Just having a system like that I know you know your stuff but im just trying to think out loud :man_shrugging:

Let me know if im way off here :laughing:

3 Likes
7

I can tell you a part of the problem now. Your system is Medusa v2. What does your injection manifold look like? The manifolds on your collection vessel is not adequate for easy flow. How often do you clean your lines? Do you have residue buildup at the bottom of the tri clover ferrule tubes?

Do yourself a favor. Keep it simple. Break down the basics of how to run your system. After you master the CLS head back to the CRC.

2 Likes
8

I do a 4 to 1 soak. Something simple for you to try, i think itll give you yield difference, is heat your butane tank before ya run. Running a tank at 5lb pressure thats ice cold yields me 13 to 14 percent return. Blonde yellow color. If put my tank in hot water for 5 minutes, build to 40 to 50 which is almost standard storage pressure, i yield solid 19 percent. Consistantly. I run a 5lb icuras. Only fit. 2.5 to 2.8 lbs. Ive packed it with a damn poolstick before i i cannot fit 5lb in. Idk how people so it. Unless i powderize the product which is a no

9

is this trim? Those numbers seem a little high for trim. You may want to homogenize a sample of what you got and have it re tested. You may see the numbers more inline with your yield.

8 Likes
10

What does your end product look like?

11

most companies have no idea how much biomass fits in a column, if it is a new size you better bet I filled it with trim and weighed it.

you’d be suprised, a 8"x40 column holds 13 lb of crappy trim.

3 Likes
12

Word. Its 4x48

1 Like
13

yeah, that’s a kilo machine for sure! You might be able to fit 3 -4 lbs of some really high % ground bud in there. The issue is the numbers vary so much with material density, I like to go worse case scenario with the trim as a metric. The other variable is packing density goes down with wider tubes, same packing force, just spread over a wider area…

2 Likes
14

Im a bigger guy and i put all i had into packing the last run i did. Id pack roughly 2 handfulls then pack and repeat for maximum compression and still couldnt hit 3 packed. Thanks tho now i wont keep trying to wrap my head around people telling me they could fit 5lb easy

1 Like
16

Check this link I posted a while back. This will help show the importance of biomass size as @Soxhlet mentioned.
Biomass size matters

3 Likes
17

Ill stick with my nitrate gloves and break up to a nice 2mm consistancy by hand then thanks for the slide.

18

Are you saying you can only get 2.8 lbs into a 4x48?

2 Likes
19

Without blending to a powder yeah

20

I fit 5-7# in a 4x48
Not milled, whole plant bimoass, bucked on a cannagin packed in the tube with a stainless packing rod from buds hydro. The stainless rod allowed me to go from consistently packing 5#per tube to consistently packing 7#

Also is it one 4x48 or two 4x24? I ask because I have 2 4x24’s and if i pack them seperately and then connect i dont get as much as if i pack it assembled at 48"

4 Likes
21

I just got my most ever into a tube. I smashed it hitting it hard over and over with a 2 inch dowel till packed like a rock. edit- I got 2 lbs into a 4 x 18 which is double what I usually get in it.

1 Like