Anyone here doing ultrasonic extraction and getting accurate lab results?
Every lab we have tried hasn’t provided accurate test results and neither us or the labs can figure it out. Anyone else have this same issue or possible solutions?
Accurate using what metric?
How many labs?
How many samples?
How did you decide they were not correct?
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So far four professional labs and one private lab, multiple samples. The results were far off based on the starting material and effect it gave users. Lab results were around 3% or less. Just based on effect, I would estimate we are somewhere in the 30-50%+
From what the labs are telling us, the first problem is our extract water soluble and their test is hydrophobic. The other issue is they speculate that liquid chromatography is not the best test for nano particles and most labs only use mas spec for pesticide.
The farthest we have gotten is in my buddies lab where he measured and removed the water, then tested. But still the numbers were around 6-7%.
Everyone who has tried it agrees its potent, no one argues that. The lab results don’t add up at all and so far no one has come up with a solution for getting accurate results.
Why are you using mass spec?
Your trying to obtain particle size and polydistibution. Correct?
If you’ve increased bioavailability, then your results may be consistent…
Have you looked at what you’re leaving behind?
How many grams THC (or CBD) per mL are you shooting for? typically I do 10mg/mL to 40mg/mL. 3rd party lab tested using HPLC and get consistent results every time.
What’s your input oil? Distillate? CO2 oil? whats the potency?
Using liquid chromatography not mas spec, but labs have recommended it.
We have looked at residual in biomass/flower and it looks normal, very minimal left behind.
shooting for at least 10mg/gram. I know its higher though, well it certainly feels like it. But last test ew only got 3.7mg/gram
We are using organic vegetable glycerin as a carrier and starting with high potency flower for the extraction.
Aha I was thinking you were trying to make a nano emulsion. You’re trying to extract cannabinoids and terps ect into VG using sonication? It most likely just comes down to time and temp of VG in contact with the plant material. I dont know what the specific saturation point of VG or at what point VG doesnt become as efficient at pulling cannabinoids. Also how are you “rinsing” the plant material post sonication, to not leave cannabinoids beind in the biomass?
into glycerin?
I’m gonna go out on a limb and suggest the analytical labs are more than likely on point.
in my experience glycerin is a terrible solvent for cannabinoids. ultrasonic emulsification might be expected to help with that, but it still strikes me as the hard way of getting a dose of cannabinoids.
did you do the mass balance?
how far off does that put your analytical lab?
do you have COA’s for each step along the way?
Yes, vg sonication.
We have been straining so far with a light wash but will be using a centrifuge soon.
VG obviously in’t the best for pulling, be it seemed like a viable option for particular uses.
The biggest issue is that after trying the extract, you definitely feel it. I have a high tolerance, and big 240lbs, and it hits me hard. However lab results don’t back it up. The last lab said 0.37% total cannabinoids, if that was true, I wouldn’t even feel it…
So at this point I cn say its off, but not sure how far off.
then redo the workup with COA’s at every step…
if you can prove to an analytical chemist that cannabinoids are disappearing, they’ll work much harder to find them for you…
Have the flower lab tested prior to extractiong and then test the flower post extraction that will help indicated if cannabinoids are actually being extracted into your VG.
Yes VG is not the best solvent. But I feel like based on the effect, stating material and everything else, we should be above the 0.37% total we got from the last lab.
Not sure if they did a mass balance but yes COAs along the way, from starting material to finished product. Our last run, starting material was 19% total cannabinoids and we got 0.37% total on the concentrate. I literally could have extracted basil and got higher numbers than that…
What recommendations would you have?
I feel like we are on to something but havent found a way to validate it… Would you try a different solvent, if so what?
they don’t do the mass balance. YOU do.
how many mg of THC did you start with in that 19% input.
how many mg left after extraction?
how many mg should that put in your vg?
how many does the lab find…
you haven’t tried to “validate” if you haven’t done the mass balance and are simply convinced the lab must have it wrong.
I’ve seen evidence of isomeriztion under sonication…
you might have made something new.
eg @Kingofthekush420 was onto something here Chromatogram: 3% THC AND the lab was absolutely correct in telling him that his sample only contained 3% delta 9 THC
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how much of this biomass did you extract?
in what volume of glycerin (how much did you add)?
how much glycerin did you lose to the biomass?
(did you weigh the biomass? or measure the volume recovered?)
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You can definely have isomerization under pressure with heat also
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Doubt it’s a lab problem. How much glycerin did you use, to how much flower? What was flower potency before and after?