Please make a thread for this topic and I will respond. I promise.
I want to keep this thread on topic.
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I don’t think it’s been determined and 100% ruled out completely. Has the fda approved the use of vitamin e for vaping?
Do you sell this stuff @anon87263109 or is @qma jumping to conclusions?
Do you support the use of this stuff @anon87263109? Do you use this personally? I’m kinda curious as no one I’ve ever know has seen this stuff or used it?
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I agree hasn’t been 100% ruled out that VAPI is caused by vit E acetate. But the same can be said for VG/PG, vape hardware and lots of other things. However, the data about dates of vit E acetate market entry and usage, and findings from the Mayo Clinic study, make a very strong argument that VAPI is not caused by vit E acetate.
This is so important because if everyone thinks it’s one thing, but it’s really something else, many more people could get sick because they think they are ‘safe’ by not vaping the thing that is falsely accused. It’s like crying wolf, but not on purpose.
This has real world impacts, real people could get sick. That’s why I care about this issue.
QMA is jumping to conclusions. I don’t sell or use ‘cutters’. If QMA wants to start a thread I would respond. But I want this thread to stay on topic. This issue is too important to be derailed.
I only know what I’ve read about. I read a lot. There is a lot of info out there. Leafly, NYT, WSJ, WaPo, BuzzFeed, LA Times, NEJM, Scholar, Gnews, Dank Vape Busters, Insta and many more sources, plus friends in Cali.
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I am not supporting the vaping of vit E acetate. But I’m also not disparaging it. I am not taking a position. And I am not trying to imply otherwise with the following info about cigarettes and the FDA. This info is just so we can all work with the same facts.
Nope. But the FDA also hasn’t approved THC or CBD for vaping.
For cigarettes, the list of 599 additives submitted to the US Department of Health and Human Services in April 1994 includes vitamin e as “Tochopherols (mixed)”. Vitamin e is used as a antioxidant/mitigant, and alpha-tocopherol was “extensively studied by RJ Reynolds for addition to cigarettes for mitigant effect”.
The FDA’s Harmful and Potentially Harmful Constituents in Tobacco Products; Established List and the Proposed Additions list (for vapes) do not include vitamin e.
last year black market knockoff carts like supreme,mario carts ,exotic etc were testing at 60-70 % thc… now some of them are testing at 23 %. they are being cut to ridiculous levels with god knows what.
even with vitamin e/terps/mystery oil accounted for some of these carts have another 20-30% of cut unnacounted for.
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When I saw that I thought the same thing. I’m like what about the huge amount of unknown mateiral?
The fact a few people have gotten sick only from vapes from legal shops (like in OR), and from nic only carts really muddies the water. The fact it’s not only illegal carts is interesting.
Is this true 
I don’t think they mentioned vitamin E acetate at all.
Vitamin E acetate can and will produce acetic acid when heated in vaporizers.
I have seen this myself by analyzing vapor on a GCMS.
This still doesn’t mean it is the cause of the burns because only a portion of the carts turned in for analysis contained vitamin E acetate.
Another issue with all of this is these patients are only submitting the most recent cartridge they’ve been using, which may exclude other products they have been using. Most people do not exclusive use one brand, they use whatever they can get. Meaning if vitamin E acetate were the culprit, it wouldn’t necessarily have to be in every cart that has been turned in for analysis.
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They Mayo Clinic authors talk about lipids, oils in the study and in their blog, and vit E oil in the WSJ and NYT articles. The study didn’t look for vit E acetate oil, but instead looked for oil and lipoid pneumonia. Because the claim by many people so far has been vit E acetate oil caused VAPI through lipoid pneumonia, which has been proven incorrect.
Vit E oil and other oils were basically ruled out as the cause of VAPI because no oil was found on the lung tissue samples, and none of the patients had lipoid pneumonia. That’s because so far most doctors assumed from educated guesses that all patients had some type lipoid pneumonia (due to presence of lipid-laden macrophages).
But like I wrote a few times already, I agree nothing has been ruled out in terms of toxic chemical damage, which is what the Mayo Clinic study claims is the cause of VAPI patients they studied. Not lipoid pneumonia.
The average onset time is 6 days to 2 weeks. That’s why most of the carts that could have gotten people sick, and still had material to test, were able to be tested.
After taking all things into consideration, it’s still very unlikely that vit E acetate is the cause. It just isn’t a common factor, and VAPI has been happening since around 2016, long before vit E acetate was used, and people who only use nic carts have VAPI too.
terpenes are essentially hydrocarbon solvents and can dissolve organic polymers (epoxy)
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I think Magisterchemist may be onto something regarding coils and batteries. It makes sense because those would also affect nic only users. I can’t think of another common factor, except for some unknown toxic chemical in all samples of THC and nic carts.
Someone told me a few months back that the cheap china carts that smoke shops retail for $10 slowly melt and eventually contaminate your product. I thought this person was crazy. Now that I think about it…I used many of these cheap China carts. They usually only last 1 month, maybe if you get lucky 2 months max. Then you throw it away and go get another one for $10. I am starting to think that maybe these cheap carts do indeed melt. I know this is still a theory but it also makes sense. My friend has a $60 battery and he’s had it for over a year and it still works great…
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I think so far everyone agrees that vitamin E oil is not responsible for lipoid pneumonia.
Also that the issue here is not lipoid pneumonia, it is a chemical burn.
I agree it is a stretch to claim that vitamin E acetate is solely responsible. I’m merely stating that vaping vitamin E acetate creates acetic acid which can burn your lungs. I’m sure there are plenty of other possible sources of caustic compounds, but this is definitely one of them.
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I don’t think this guy wants to hear that lol… I’ve been following this post all day.
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I don’t see how it could be CRC related either. If that was the case we ought to have seen some cases of it occuring in dabbers
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I agree. I don’t understand the need for any of this shit. I feel like this is just a test. Let’s just see the people that do this right and let’s see who does this wrong.
I came to this forum thinking I was dumb as fuck. I learnt sooo much and realized while I might not be as smart as these classically trained experts. I have something you just cant learn in school!..
Anyone what to know what it is…
Morals! 
.
I would never play god with someone health over a piece of paper with some slave owners on it. I think some people need to look in the mirror and ask themselves is what they are doing is right. Would you like to be on the receiving end of these products. We all have to eat. Would you enjoy if all your food was cut with an unknown substance. Lol.
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Couldn’t agree more.
Yeah vitamin E might not be the culprit…
BUT WHY PUT VITAMIN E OIL IN VAPES AT ALL??? There is just no reason for it.
whyyyyyyyyyyy???
???
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If it is NOT vit E, I find it a coincidence (and I dont believe in coincidences) that all the major terp players immediately pulled all their vit E products off the shelves and deleted all their sales pitches, dissapeared, and edited the posts on here.
2+2 =4 in my book
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There are drums of vit E acetate being sold right now on the row in LA. There are many places to go buy counterfeit Honey Cut right now. The use of vit E acetate apparently hasn’t stopped. All according to NYT and Leafly.
What you describe isn’t a coincidence, but it’s also not any type of evidence or proof. I would guess the companies did that because they are trying to be good actors. And besides, if VAPI was caused by vit E acetate the number of cases should have already slowed and started to go down after companies stopped selling it because onset is 6-14 days, but they aren’t.
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I mean i don’t think that’s a major surprise. For the first few weeks Vitamin E was being fingered as major suspect in the news and in the community. That alone is sufficient reason. It’s not like those vape makers are medical experts. And it seems most people vaping even the carts with thickeners aren’t having these problems, just a select minority
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But I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night 
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