That hearing and chilling arrangement sounds similar to 3 pipe VRF systems. Pretty cool.
I saw that your compressor is called an IE-91. Is that a t91 or an e91 from Corken?
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What is the purpose of the “Base” in your set up? is this for water based “bubble hash” or BHO?
reading your post it sounds like you want to chill the collection pot on your bho system before engaging recovery?
just trying to clarify.
The point of this is thread is to make it so that a refrigerant can circulate through the jacket and be used instead of an alcohol, glycol or a standardized coolant/controlled refrigerant.
@Zack_illuminated seems to have made it so there is no need for a cascade refrigeration system but is also dropping small bits of knowledge along the way of how he made it possible.
… The base is a collection base.
The idea is dangerous and its better to not attempt janky shit to try to get it to work but i suppose getting the right fabrication done to have high pressure rated equipment would help.
If @Zack_illuminated is ever on the east coast and has the design ready for show and tell at like a cannabis expo or something, then I’d love to check it out. 
It’s fascinating that someone has this down.
Deleted the part about the recovery pump cause it’s more involved then that and if it’s done wrong it can be explosive so don’t attempt the needle nose valve and recovery pump thing. Like 80% not safe the other 20% could fuck you up don’t try it 
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I use a 4"x48" jacked column inline between my collection pot and solvent/storage tank. Both the jacketed column and storage tank are being chilled on a cascade chiller running through them in series.
I had thoughts about running a minis split using the 4"x48" jacketed column as the evaporator portion of the mini split. this would allow the cascade chiller to just work on the storage tank. The 4"x48" column would just be used to recover collection pot vapor turn it into liquid to send back to the storage tank.
This allows you to pull vapor off the collection pot during injection and lets me run lower nitrogen pressure during injection and clearing of material column. “usually about 20 psi”
I’d be interested in figuring out how to make a split system work. split being chiller on the storage/injection tank and mini split on the jacketed vapor column. Obviously this still requires a chiller but I think it’s more efficient to separate the work load…
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I never looked at it as a split system until now
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If you divide your thermal load then you can speed up the turn around time.
The compressor will never handle that for long. We have played around with a 3 ton minisplit condenser and different txv valves on a tube in tube evaporator. I got some help from my buddy Jeff that’s a process engineer. I had it laying around and begged him to help me lol. After some part ordering on Amazon we threw it together well drinking one night in the shop. The lowest we could get was - 10f on 410a. The compressor eventually failed from lack of oil return at such cold Temps. You could use 410a and the condenser but the compressor won’t last or get you to its boiling point of around - 40f. It sucked ass on recovery of butane. We played with txv valves for days trying and failing. What it did work great for was the glycol chiller at a high temp for our bar taps. We scrapped the idea and that’s it purpose these days. Cold beer 
3 ton a bit overkill but it’s an inverter so it’s efficient. You really need a cascade for the temp required. Zack has all that figured out without a cascade. He’s a genius.
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I’m guessing @Zack_illuminated has a way of keeping the compressor, “dry.”
@Zack_illuminated is also using r290 not r410a.
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Some may say our tech is not novel or unique… haters always exist. 
Traditional refrigeration and heat pump systems only get you so far and then you hit a wall.
Our tech solves both ends of the equation - heating and cooling. My goal is -150c with a single compressor/refrigerant (non-cascade) and we are only 44c away from that goal so far. Think we can hit it now with the latest modification. Looking forward to using propane to freeze butane as a simple demonstration.
The refrigerant r410a actually has a lower boiling point than r290 but a higher freezing point. We could use it in place of r290 as our tech works with all refrigerants and is not limited to just propane. 
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Direct refrigeration in the column jacket is definitely king. However, if you’re wanting to convert a system with jackets that aren’t rated for those pressures, you could create individual coolant loops with a pump and heat exchanger on each column using a refrigeration arrangement like the picture above to heat and chill the HEs. This would, of course, limit you to your coolant’s freezing point.
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I have spent many hours researching the subject and there is nothing else in existence currently that uses the process we have created.
According to the preliminary report and written opinion from the international bureau of patents, we received only “A” references on our direct refrigeration system, which are not considered to be of important relevance. This leads us to believe our tech is very unique and novel. 
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Oil doesn t realy freeze out if that’s what you are trying 
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The freezing point of butane is -138c… That is warmer than our ultimate goal of -150c.
Not trying to crash cannabinoids in this case… literally just showing that propane as a single refrigerant system can get to true cryogenic temperatures.
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Amazing 
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If the demo is still happening in April dm me where and when 
I’m so fucking down to see this irl.
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This is exactly what I was thinking illuminated extractors was doing, because I had the same idea when i was pondering diying a dx chiller. My brain said, why figure out how to dump heat when i pay for heat just a few ft away?
Maybe we can cooperatively develop the process. @SidViscous and @Soxhlet could probably lend quite a bit of insight and I know many would be grateful for it including me🙏
If anyone doesnt understand something i will gladly clarify anythibg technical. It is difficult to convey.
Assuming no heat tranfer happens except at the heat exchangers (HEX) and compressor (might be a decent approximate assumption), the heat absorbed by the evaporator (solvent tank in our case) plus the heat added by the compressor, is equal to the amount of heat that must be rejected by the condenser (collection/recovery/honey pot). That means the the collection has more evaporative power than the solvent tank has condensing power, by the amount of energy the compressor applies to the refrigerant.
As the solvent tank cools, which happens quickly if nearly empty due to hydrocarbon solvent being in other parts of the system at the moment, the deltaT shrinks, slowing heat transfer. That heat is transfered to the collection (or a preheater, tube and shell, etc) where it causes boiling of our solvent. The solvent evaporates, creates pressure, and travels via pressure differential to the low temperature, low pressure volume inside the chilled solvent tank, where it condenses.
I believe this trend will continue, and the hot side will always have slightly more power than the cold side, until only hash and very little solvent remains in the collection, without any solvent evaporating to remove heat from and condense the refrigerant.
At that point the solvent tank should be almost full and we’d be looking to chill it while packing and vacuuming columns for the next run.
I think, more optimally, the use of a very low temp chiller or two (maybe cascade or water cooled or ice machine cooled) on the jacket and columns as is standard. And seperately, the chiller circuit described above on a falling film evaporator and condenser. And maybe an auxillary heat source (instant shower) on the jacket of collection.
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It isn’t novel. It is pretty unique. Im pretty stoked that you brought it to market. Id live to see a demo
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Your evap pressures will be between .123 and 1.53 (psia)…thats negative but not impossible. I believe it is risky for your equipment if it ever has a leak on the cold side
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We have special columns that are made specifically rated for our conditions.
We also use only Gylon gaskets as they have an impressive high and low temperature rating and have a long life period.
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No one has actually figured out what we are doing, but keep saying its not novel and in some cases not unique either. There is a very novel and unique aspect that makes everything work.
We will be showcasing our system in OKC June 3 & 4th at our extraction and tech class along side @waxplug1, @SamboCreeck.com, and many other great minds.
Get tickets here:
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