I asked solvent direct a very simple question on their ig about what impurities they found that were conclusively causing fast crash and Medusa issues.
I was blocked. I know I’m a dickhead but this was just a run of the mill question.
@SolventDirect_BigM @SolventDirect maybe we can continue the conversation here.
This was a dm from another gas supplier that has me asking even more questions.
Thanks
I brought this to light here months ago when i made a fuss demanding a CoA showing ABSOLUTE ZERO for residuals from concentrates/extracts made with solvents.
Lots of analytical labs will produce ND so the vendors using their analytics will continue to do so, allowing for the this is pure shit man bullshit the US market is vomiting out.
Even if you source a clean “pure” (they don’t exist) solvent and even if your methods are perfect (they’re not) and even if you hit 99.999999999, that still isn’t pure and if you don’t know what that mystery substance is
Your products shouldn’t be legal for sale.
That seems really weird to me. We have accepted limits for impurities in just about everything. And I mean everything.
Why are you trying to treat the cannabis industry like its different from all other consumer product industries that have acceptable limits for impurities?
There is nothing out there that is 100% of anything and most things don’t even get close. Controlling for the types and kinds of impurities is important - but acting like they should never exist is really far from the reality of production around the globe.
We’re way better at it today than we were 50 years ago and there’s still impurities everywhere. And we’re better at keeping them out of all kinds of stuff than we have been for centuries and there’s still impurities everywhere.
You’re operation probably adds more impurities from product contact surfaces and interactions with materials of construction.
Its okay for us to have standards and we should but the standard needs to be reasonable and everyone needs to agree on it. <3
I 100% hope you’ll be joining us in Denver in June for the ASTM conference that will talk about things like this. Standards for impurities in materials being used in our industry. I talk to other people about these things all the time - some people don’t care at all! And some people, like you, think there should never be impurities.
The truth is somewhere in the middle and we have to agree as an industry on what kind of methods are possible to prevent downstream issues, costs involved with upstream and downstream controls, potential risks to consumers, potential risks to employees/operators, and then all arrive at a solution together.
Lucky for us - we get to be involved in the process for saying what the limits of detection and quantitation MUST BE for someone to say something is ND. And we get to be involved in the process for defining which impurities must be checked for.
Hell - 10 years ago no one checked to see if there was butane or propane left over in concentrates. And now we check those down to the ppm. Maybe in the future we’ll check them to the ppb (I mean you seem to be implying we should be checking them beyond current technology…but who knows where technology will take us!)
Are you planning to come to Denver for the conference discussing this stuff? Cause I’m gonna be there and we need more voices from people who actually do this work. Cause there are plenty of people that will be there that have never created a concentrate, or consumed one… and are suppliers of packaging components or tanks or batteries or something.
We need more - us. <3
Almost like Envee has no idea what the fuck he’s talking about. Weird!
I feel you but those impurtities should be listed on the COA no?
my operation doesnt add methanol or amines
you know alot of people using n-butane or Propane 10 years ago? my first test was in 2015 at the secret cup and i was only person with 0ppm due to n-propane use.
Impurities are ever present, you are correct, but they should only be treated as acceptable when we are aware of what they are and as long as there is evidence to cite that they are infact safe to consume alongside the substances you intended to consume.
If they are not safe, people need to be informed of their presence and in my opinion there isn’t enough being done to ensure that notion is a reality and i find it to be infuriating.
Agreeable or not, profitable or not, reasonable or not, above all do no harm.
Primum Non Nocere!
I know it may read as if i imply there should be no impurities, my intention is to raise awareness that many vendors claim 100% when that is not the reality, the shenanigans i pulled with my CoA tantrum were intended to point out where we draw the limit… ppm? ppb? ppt?
The accuracy of reports claiming 100% is currently based on how hard we’re looking and the question here should be what impurities are present, what is acceptable and to what degree?
It’s something I’ll consider, I have a ton of research on the go and some of it would be very relevant to such a discussion.
I couldn’t agree more! Thank you for the kind words, i enjoyed reading your thoughts on the matter.
Our priority is to supply the highest purity products for the best price and with the 1st class service extractors deserve. We are actively working with multiple organizations to write new standards for safe lab supply.
We appreciate constructive discourse and collaboration. We rarely block anyone because we want the feedback for better or worse, but if you’re @onlyfarmscannabis fka @cloneguruz, don’t get it confused, you werent blocked for commenting on gas purity.
You were blocked for harassing females in our comments. Specifically, family from the bizzy bee team. We fired a warning shot and asked you to chill and you kept going at her. Find some other page to pick fights with girls.
Are you aware of impurities in your products, if any?
Is their disclosure of impurities?
Do you know what they are?
Are these impurities safe for human consumption in all forms if they remain as a residual separate from the solvent itself in a cannabis extract/concentrate?
I mean no disrespect, i am genuinely curious.
At Solvent Direct, we genuinely care about our customers, as well as the end users. We are taking proactive measures to lead the industry in improvements on purity, testing, and standards. Our gas has been consistently testing higher than the instrument grade standard of 99.5%, closer to 99.8-99.9%. We are still looking for unknown impurities and ways to identify them, and we are still learning just like the rest of the community.
We are always willing to work with our customers and anyone else on improving purity and knowledge of the solvents and consumables used. We welcome you to share your theories and findings along with your questions. I will do my best to answer any questions and share freely.
These are great questions. Please keep in mind we dont sell butane for consumption. Pam cooking spray has more butane in it than compliant bho for consumption, but i think i know what you’re asking…
This is a big part of what Solvent Direct is doing with the and other organizations. We are doing our part to help university researchers, scientists and industry to develop safe standards for extraction.
Send your questions on dm and i will see if we can organize a panel or town hall with @Future. Please send via dm, we have 17 trucks on the road and i just cant keep up with these threads.
More on Pam…
Care to address any questions regarding the impurities and how they are causing Medusa or not and if they weren’t on your cis before how can we make sure they aren’t now?
Methanol and amines aren’t allowed by my state to use as a solvent.
@Extractionperson you started a good thread, sparking good conversation, why did you need to get toxic?
Did you see where coffee cup boy accused me of “harassing females”
That’s libel.
He gets a day to change it or he might be upset by my reaction
You first accused them/claimed they aren’t being transparent with their products.
You barked, he barked back, then you decided to bite.
Bad dog.
Them not being transparent with their products will be answered to the FTC not me. He’s gonna have a libel issue with me in 24hrs
Filing a request as we speak
Section 12 of the FTC Act, 15 U.S.C. § 52 Says these types of false lab reports are misleading
They had methanol in their gas and the coa didn’t have it on it.
This is gonna be a fun thread. 
I love when people that accuse others of nonsense then cry libel.
It seems that methanol was the culprit for Medusa formations, and I have not heard any reports of methanol or Medusa formations from our gas since switching to X Gas. There were reports of methanol in our gas that we took very seriously, which led us to increase our efforts and research.
Amines are the major suspect as far as fast crash reactions are concerned. There have been considerably less instances of fast crashing with X Gas. We are continuing to work towards perfection, and have made great strides, but there are still some kinks to work out.
Most of our customers have had extremely great results getting over fast crashing, but there are a few who are still having some issues. It is of utmost importance to work as closely with these customers as possible to analyze the entire process and obtain samples for further research. We value any and all input and will continue to work as closely as people are willing to in effort to continually improve solvent supply for all.
This was a great answer. Thank you.
I understand this, you sell a product with the intended/primary use of it being that… a solvent, not a consumable, i am in no way suggesting @SolventDirect as a company or entity is responsible for human consumption of the products they offer or that they are liable for the human consumption of consumables made using their solvents.
Based on that statement you’re implying residual solvents are harmful… which is odd, as I never questioned residual solvents… i questioned residual impurities in the solvent/left behind from the use of said solvent.
Are these impurities also in pam… is that your point?
Pam has been linked to numerous accusations of health issues, but the parent company escaped liability by claiming people misuse the product and often overheat it.
Regardless of what your intentions were with the reference of Pam cooking spray… I’ve never smoked anything with Pam in it… BHO is generally consumed via combustion and inhalation.
You’ll get extremely sick if you inhale any cooking sprays… not just pam… I’d imagine the combustion and inhalation of pam is carcinogenic regardless of the LPG propellant used… (primarily propane/butane).
Thank you, i will contact you in private for further questioning.
You just posted that your gas “has been consistently testing higher than instrument grade standard of 99.5%, closer to 99.8 - 99,9%”
SD’s website proudly provides this analysis of it’s X-gas at 99.991%. What is it really???
99.5%, with 5,000 ppm contaminates?
99.8%, with 2,000
99.9%, with 1,000
or 99.991%, with 90
99.991% is hard to believe.
I appreciate the thoughtful and cogent responses you have sent. I’m just trying to determine how much validity your statements hold.
