I've been reading alot about BHO on here, please critique my what I think I learned!

[JazzBandit]

@710enigmatic
I will deff swap the clamps and freeze the material/solvent/rig to at least -25f. Thanks for the heads up on felt filters and mixing keif to avoid clogs!

Could I ask for specifics about the co2? I’ve seen many people warn not to and thus probably just won’t… BUT… an engineer friend that is VERY knowledgable about heat-transfer, thermal dynamics, and fluid dynamics (employed by siemens to work on multi-ton turbines) walked me through the theory and some of the math, and his conclusion was that it would be easy and to reliably vent residual co2 with negligible butane loss. I don’t claim to understand what he knows, or what the extraction community does, I am trying to wrap my head around any theory or anecdotal information available because it will almost certainly come in handy for other similar situations.

@BigM
Thanks friend, I feel like I at least understand many of the decisions I need to inform myself about!

Fortunately, I’ve already distilled the solvent several times now, partially just to get used to some of the equipment/processes. I will keep an eye on the quick-connects, if leaks develop is there an o-ring to replace or should I just replace the whole thing?
I hadn’t thought about shelter, actually, I have been in a clearing in between a few shelterbelts in a consistent 20+mph wind. Less wind would be nicer to work in, but I wonder if the wind and lack of corners helps prevent an explosive density of gas from accumulating. Nothing electrical is out there yet, but I’ve been debating bringing out some aquarium heaters for the collection chamber bath, would that be a safety concern?

@thumper
You are right of course, this account is brand new. When I started reading this was one of many forums populating dozens (hundreds?) of tabs. I just created an account by linking my gmail, which is my full name. So I made a new account that is not literally my legal name before posting. I hope that you don’t feel I’m wasting anyone’s time by neglecting to research to the best of my current ability.

@StoneD
I just get a few smaller beverage coolers, using a larger cooler like you suggested makes a lot of sense because it would increase thermal capacity. I’ll get on that. Is the smaller cooler alright for cooling because it’s easy to just add more dry ice?

It sounds like you are saying that the co2 issue isn’t related to vaporization of fluid, but expansion of gas. That helps me understand why a pre-purge co2 vent won’t solve the problem entirely. My (frankly uninformed) sense is that the increase in pressure would only be several dozen psi, I’ll read up on it
Thanks for the help!

[StoneD]

@JazzBandit

just get a few smaller beverage coolers, using a larger cooler like you suggested makes a lot of sense because it would increase thermal capacity. I’ll get on that. Is the smaller cooler alright for cooling because it’s easy to just add more dry ice?

Yes and yes… The smaller cooling cooler will allow you to use less denatured alcohol slurry and less dry ice to cool it

[thumper]

I once tried a foam cooler and the alchohol leaked through the foam and it was saturated and leaking, I couldnt find any cracks. Is it normal for foam to do that with alcohol?

[Pupparoo]

I just plumbed/ran a hot water line from my house to an exterior hose bib. Then hooked a hose up to that and ran it to my outdoor (under a lean to) extraction area. Worked fine and was just a Few bucks in pex and shark bite fittings. Ghetto tek, but it worked fine for my little set up.

I never ran a souse vide just because I was worried about the source of ignitition near my collection (in case I had a leak during recovery)

Only use n2 gas. Not co2 or liquid n2. Use the search bar and search “nitrogen assist”

[cyclopath]

Yep. That is expected.

[thumper]

I returned it. I dont have a cooler big enough for a 12 inch collection so I use bus tubs for dry ice. i left my denatured ethanol out due to laziness and i think it got wet soaking water out the air and when i put it in the can now its all rusty. Dont do that.

[JazzBandit]

@thumper
Good to know! I’ve made a point of looking up what materials different components are made of. Poly hoses/containers seem to work well for hot/cold fluids including iso, though they become more brittle when cold. I don’t’t use Poly for anything touching consumable products though.

@Pupparoo
That sounds like a slick setup for using existing equipment, I’ll give it a go when things get above freezing here. I imagine I could bury/insulate a pipe and give it a go now.

I have the same concern about a souse vide, as tempted as I am by the simplicity. Part of me wants to justify using one by only extracting on windy days that are too cold to accommodate gaseous butane.
Right now I’m tinkering with the idea of using a small gasoline pump attached to the bung on the cooler (after replacing the spout with a 1/2" bulkhead). It would allow me to place hot water and cold iso coolers 10ft away and pump the fluids to the system. It should be spark-proof and portable, I attached a picture of it’s current state.

I ordered an n2 regulator and will swing by airgas for nitro and a tank on Monday. I’ve read/seen a few descriptions of how to use nitro assist and it makes sense. I’ve had a lot of trouble finding specifics, do you have a link to somewhere I can read about co2 assist failure? It feels like I have a huge fog in my head surrounding the science behind why co2 isn’t able to be vented prior to purge (sorry I’m so hung up on this, I have trouble leaving unknowns alone).

Also, a question about forum etiquette/rules. I feel like I just dumped way to many questions in one disorganized post, is it acceptable to copy/paste many of my questions into short categorical lists and repost them in separate posts? Not looking to spam, but it feels like I biffed it by posting all of this together…

Thanks everyone for the help!

[FicklePickle]

@Pupparoo

never ran a souse vide

You aren’t missing much. It sucks! Hot water heater for the win

[Pupparoo]

@JazzBandit

I imagine I could bury/insulate a pipe and give it a go now.

Or just roll your hose up when you are done and store indoors. That’s what I did haha

[StoneD]

We had 2 sous vide that we’re on steroids they would heat 50-70gal water in min and keep it the same temp

Ur way smarter but we did pump on it through the jacket instead setting the collection baase in the hot water cooler bc his was jacketed

I like the round orange water cooler w stand to keep it off bottom for my cooling cooler takes less slurry and or dry ice. That cooler is neat as fuck

If I’m not mistaken co2 changes psi w temperature where nitrogen vapors do not move over such side range of temp like we use, dry ice cold then warm water, the cow would have changing psi if not mistaken and God forbid if u left some in there and warmed up

@cyclopath @FicklePickle @WhereAreTheStones is this right about co2 and temperature psi swings where nitrogen is constant…I tried using argon once worked but seems like it dissolved into the butane solution and I could never get the violent boilng to stop

[WhereAreTheStones]

A tankless water heater is definitely the way to go, but even the mini tanks are a step up from the sous vides IMO. I planned on adding a 1.5kw bucket heater to the reservoir with the pump but haven’t felt the need to. Definitely nice for a portable system.

[710enigmatic]

The reason why you don’t use co2 instead of n2, is co2 can fluctuate based on its inherent density vs. N2. you can condense to a solid (dry ice) with ease comparably with n2 as well.
Thats why n2 is used in tires, it doesn’t fluctuate pressure easily from environmental factors like temperature hense easier to vent while assisting.
Personally we don’t like using n2, why vent went you can pressure assist or hot loop manipulating the gas do what you need to be done, although this will not be the case w/o a pump or dual tank system.
Co2 also becomes chemically active with the presence of moisture which can cause further issues. and say you do use it like n2, if it condenses and its left alone who knows how much was put in and how much expansion it will create causing unsafe and irregular pressure increases

[StoneD]

@710enigmatic

how much expansion it will create causing unsafe and irregular pressure increases

So it an fluctuate in psi?

[WhereAreTheStones]

[StoneD]

If I read the right it is huge difference in -42 degrees and 70degrees… drastic difference don’t use co2

[710enigmatic]

yes sir, a catastrophe waiting to happen

[WhereAreTheStones]

[StoneD]

so don’t use co2 unless you wanna blow ur gaskets or vessels bc they are not rated that much

800-1100psi at room temperature yeah not me

[JazzBandit]

@710enigmatic
I appreciate you taking time to lay out why nitrogen is superior. Gaseous Nitrogens resistance to thermal expansion compared to co2 increases safety. I hadn’t even thought about how the two interact with moisture differently, in fact nitrogen isn’t just less bad on this front, it can proactively dry the system. Having a comparable cost and ease of acquisition clearly makes it a more ideal tool in this use case.

@WhereAreTheStones
Thanks for posting that array of points from the co2 phase diagram and details about said phase change, I’m a fan of hard data! This diagram describes the pressure increase that can result from liquid co2 evaporating into a closed headspace.

As described in your second post, liquid co2 has a 535:1 expansion ratio @60f, in a fixed volume that translated to about 700psi (roughly, didn’t calculate). With a system rated for MaYbE 200psi, that definitely sounds like a bomb to me.

However, I believe that the ideal gas law provides the appropriate equation (pV = nRT) to analyze this problem. The reason I believe this is that I will vent the co2 down to 0PSI @ -100f, leaving no liquid co2. If no liquid co2 will be in the tank during the temp increase (unless it is dissolved into water as suggested by @710enigmatic) there will be no phase change, only expansion of gas. I need to read up on what to expect from co2 dissolved into water in this environment, I believe it typically creates carbonic acid.

In this case, my tank is 509 cubic inches, filled to 80% capacity with tri-mix hydrocarbon, leaving 101.8 cubic inches of headspace. The tri-mix evaporates at +23f, and will thus easily remain liquid in an open container at -100f, liquid co2 cannot exist in an open container (or anywhere under 60psi). Thus, if I cool the tank to -100 and open the valve, ALL liquid co2 will evap, and we will be left with 101.9 cubic inches of co2 GAS filling the headspace at -100f and 0psi (rounded to 1psi for lazy math). That translates to 0.00692312 mole of co2 gas. If we were to heat 0.00692312 mole of co2 gas to +100f while containing it within 101.8 cubic inches, it would reach a pressure of 1.55psi. So unless my math/ignorance is dramatically skewing the results, there should be no problem. Please check my math here, I’m eager to learn.

All of this said I am going to run nitro instead of co2 because if I use co2, this whole setup is a couple of mistakes away from a bomb, and nitro is more predictable/inert.

[WhereAreTheStones]

What size is your co2 tank?

It might be worth asking your local welding supply or gas supplier if they’ll swap it for a nitrogen tank. I swap oxygen tanks for nitrogen tanks no problem.