Good Morning Guys
I have some pure terpenes from TrueTerpenes (The pack of 13 bottles), I have prepared different profiles, some offered by the page, others from our own chromatographs.
But I have noticed that even mixing about 8-11 isolated terpenes to obtain a profile, the aroma is far from being close to the aroma of cannabis.
What leads me to think if it is necessary to include other compounds to get closer to the real aroma of the flower?
Have you had experiences adding any other compound that is not a terpene to obtain more realistic profiles? Alcohols, esters ?.
I would like to know your opinions.
I think the compounds you are missing out on are terpenes most are not super familiar with, or they typically find them to be undesirable. Sequi- and tri-terpenes are probably what is missing. I most often associate them with the smell of burnt rubber mixed with rotten fish. If you are familiar with the smells of cannabinoid distillation, you’ll know what I’m talking about.
A majority of the composition of extracted terps are monoterpnes, which are highly volatile and come free from their carrier much more easily. Sesqui- and tri-terpenes have a much lower volatility and are much more difficult to remove without having effect on the material being extracted.
If one takes a vial of beautiful smelling monoterpnes and smells them on their own, they smell fine, but not quite like cannabis even when canna is derived. If one smells a vial of sesqui- and tri-terps, it will likely induce gagging and coughing in disgust if not make one vomit (seen it happen, haha). Smell them together and is smells like the flower with no hint of rotten fish and burnt rubber, a rather remarkable feat considering how bad some terps smell.
If you’re looking for a more complete profile that directly mimics the smell of the flower, I would suggest getting a hold of (or making) some HTE. It has a much more complete profile, though often still lacks a bit of the “je no se qua” that the flower has. Find a way to source someone’s leftover sauce. It works great in vapes, and can be mixed with distillate to suit one’s needs (at the cost of flavor).
You could always see about mixing a bit of the heads fraction from making distillate into your mix to see if it gets you the smell you are looking for. I haven’t tried that, but it would make for an interesting experiment. Let me know if you try it. I’d be curious to hear how it worked.
As @Akoyeh stated there are way more flavors than the big 16 we often hear and speak of
This is a coa of a steam distilled live biomass good luck finding them mixing them right and even then
The taste might lack something
Hope it gives you an understanding of the complexity of cannabis
Folks are still using @TrueTerpenes?
@cart.farm, @Octave, @OctoArm, @Betroit, @kenzyme, @Kinsmanofthesun, @MediumTroy and others all have actual cannabis (hemp included) derived essential oils/terpenes that far surpass imported isolated terpene blends.
16 oz of TT precision blend is about $2k I think. Pretty sure most guys I mentioned have high quality North American grown and processed products in that same price range.
Support local agriculture
thiols make up a big part of canna smell.
Everyone always talks about terps, but ask yourself why can we never replicate it by matching terpenes found in strains with botanical terps? There’s so much more to it than just “terpz bro”
Two common thiols found in cannabis are €-2-butene-1 and 3-methyl-1-butanethiol. They are so potent that they are found in extremely trace amounts.
Nothin better than the real thing baby.
Try the Hawaiian Punch, the latest gelato or fruitloops. We ran cement shoes sweet last week and It is awesome, loaded it onsite !
Just sayin…try these and it should solve yr issues
Grab some bho HTE and see if you can analyze and replicate the aroma
Gotta add the new Gelato to the site, need to add it to my collection
It’s pretty damn good, smells comparable to the Hawaiian Punch
We can only try to mimic the mother as close as we can till we get slapped with a wooden spoon.
I’ll be refreshing the page every 5 min waiting for you to add it to the list.
@Akoyeh : Thanks brother, you’re right, the first time I sniffed the head fraction I never imagined that cannabis could smell like that, however you’re right, that fraction is part of the “je ne se qua” you mention. I will make some Heads mixtures in different proportions with some monoterpene profile, and I will tell you the results .
@Roguelab Thanks for the COA, is a terpene analysis only true? Cannabis is definitely a super complex matrix, I think it is impossible in practical terms to replicate the aroma of the plant, but this information you provide helps me to understand theoretically why it is so difficult to do so.
@colombiabeneficial : thanks for the references on the sellers of cannabis-derived terpenes, I’ll give you a revised one. I would like to know your opinion about the similarity in aroma of these products with respect to the flower.
@krinkle: Excellent information. I didn’t know anything about this type of compound, but looking for some general information it affirms what you just mentioned about the detection threshold.
Remenber me the odor of some strains of hops when i brew some IPA beers .
@Apothecary36 : Thanks, Rouge has provided valuable information with the analysis just shown, however it seems like an impossible mission.
can you point me to the data showing these 2 thiols present in cannabis?
Here is a patent that delves into many of them. Has great descriptors for the smells, etc.
US20160250270A1.pdf (3.0 MB)
I honestly hope to see more people experimenting with them in conjunction with terpenes. We may actually achieve more cannabis like aroma having knowledge of these.
I have a few samples of them here, but they are so potent they will fill a non-ventilated area for a very long time. I am being very careful.
I am also looking into their safety regarding inhalation, they will need to be very very trace amounts to be considered “safe”.
@krinkle did u get it from a supplier?, have u ever perform some mixes with ?
I will post the CAS numbers when I have a chance.
Price points on cannabis derived terps are much more costly, usually about 4x more.
@Xcmtech showed me one that had it at 0.01%. 0.01% of the terpenes only, so as you can imagine they are extremely low concentrations in the flower. I do not want to post his findings without his approval though.
Fun fact, it’s the exact same thiol that you smell in skunked beer. Heat/light allow other molecules to produce it. This is why they say Corona beer often smells skunky. They put it in clear bottles so its More sensitive to sunlight. No clue what the ppm is like in beer though.
@stoopkid if it’s the OG analysis feel free to share.