Terpenes: my concerns

Hash and Stuff Vape Carts
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I decided to write this post after mixing terps with my CBD distillate. The fumes of the terpenes had me feeling quite woozy…

I just got done reading through the safety sheets of a couple of terpene flavors, and I had a couple of concerns. My first, and most frightening one is carbon monoxide. In section 10.6 (Hazardous Decomposition Product) of the mimosa safety sheet (https://trueterpenes.com/certificates/sds/Mimosa_PN_SDS_True_Terpenes.pdf) it states that carbon oxides form under fire conditions (carbon monoxide). I value my brain quite alot, and I would be very sad if I got brain damage from carbon monoxide. So, I want to ask what “fire conditions” include. Is there a certain heat at which carbon monoxide may form? There have been a couple occasions where I accidentally dropped a little bit of terpenes on my hotplate mixer (heated to ~80 degrees celcius) and the terpenes sizzled, smoke emerging. Would this be included as “fire conditions”, in turn creating carbon monoxide?

My second concern is formaldehyde. I understand that the terpenes themselves do not contain any cancer-causing chemicals or do they ever produce any. However, as we live in this modern world with plenty of pollution, indoor pollution is very real and there is ozone in our homes. When terpenes mix with ozone, formaldehyde is created.
“Unsaturated VOCs like monoterpenes (e.g. d-limonene and α-pinene) react with ozone to
produce radical products such as OH, HO 2 and RO 2 , as well as stable products such as
aldehydes (e.g. formaldehyde)” -Impact of Ozone-initiated Terpene Chemistry on Indoor Air Quality and Human Health (https://future4200.com/uploads/short-url/9DZXPfJ5ku5BSBwSC9BWza4AFej.pdf).
Do you have anything to say about this? As it is very concerning…

My third concern comes from experience. I was using terpenes (mimosa flavor) to mix with CBD distillate. I mixed approximately 20ml of terpenes with 250ml of CBD distillate at a temperature of 80 degrees celcius but for short periods reaching a maximum of 90 degrees celcius. During the process of mixing, the smell of the terpenes became almost overwhelming. I was wearing a cloth mask with a filter during the process (like these: https://www.polishingjewellery.co.uk/product/dust-masks/). I noticed that I became quite intoxicated. I felt lightheaded, I had issues typing correctly on my phone, I felt kind of dizzy, and I felt I had some issues speaking straight. After a short bike ride the symptomps faded a bit but persisted throughout the night. The day after I felt fine but had a headache, I took 600mg of ibuprofen and it faded. After reading that carbon monoxide could form, I got very worried that this could possibly have been due to carbon monoxide. It very well could have just been the terpenes though because in section 8.1 of the mimosa safety sheet (https://trueterpenes.com/certificates/sds/Mimosa_PN_SDS_True_Terpenes.pdf), on of the remarks is “Central nervous system impairment”. However, another and possibly more concerning one is “Lung damage”.

Can anyone confirm with me that I am not going to get carbon monoxide poisoning, inhale formaldehyde (and maybe get some cancer later on), or cause damage to my lungs, brain, or CNS by mixing terpenes indoors? And in the process, what safety measures should I take? Mixing the terpenes outdoors is not always an option. How good does ventilation have to be? What mask would protect me from the CNS effects and from possible lung damage and formaldehyde exposure?

Even better than creating a ventilation setup, what other flavoring options do I have besides terpenes? I refuse to use flavor concentrates that are mixed with MCT, are there any flavor concentrates mixable with distillate?

TL;DR: I’m concerned about carbon monoxide (produced under “fire conditions”???), concerned about formaldehyde (terpenes mixed with ozone produce formaldehyde), and I’m concerned about lung damage. I want to know what I can use to protect my self sufficiently. Or even better, what I can use other than terpenes to flavor my carts. Are there any non-MCT based flavor concentrates I can mix with distillate?

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70c is good, no need to go higher, once ur at 4 or 5% terps u can drop temp to 60C.
Only flavor inhalables with terpenes, any other flavoring is gonna mess with u.
Keep terp percentage below 7% because it sounds like ur hyper sensitive to terps.

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70c is actually too low, because my filling gun (from bvv) doesn’t work correctly unless the distillate is pre-heated to 80-85c. I don’t believe I am hyper sensitive because I can hit a cart with 8% terps just fine with no issues, but when mixing the terps and the distillate the fumes become a problem.

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theres should be no “fumes” besides the terpenes.
That temp is way too high, its not viscous at 70C with 7% terps. Ur definitely degrading terps at 85C.
U added 8% but from ur temps id assume ur probably only getting 6% in there, and losing 2% to the “fumes”

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I know the temps are high, but my gun dispenses incredibly slowly at anything less than that. What are you using to dispense your distillate?

When the distillate is heated to 70c, it takes much longer for a full ML of distillate to be dispensed and I have to wait for 2-3 droplets to leave the tip. This takes too long…

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A cart farmer. I can fill a 100 rack and cap in less than 5 minutes, at 60C on the resevoir and 65c on the gun, with 8% terps, no cuts.
I find it ironic your using a plastic barreled cart gun, and worried about the fumes from the terps. When i would be more worried about the stuff thats leaching into your terps from that plastic barrel

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Polypropylene does not degrade at 85c. Also I wouldn’t be so quick to disregard safety concerns with terps.

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Thats my point… Do u know the chemical compatibility of Polypropylene and Myrcene? How about terpinolene?

Terps are not compatible with plastics or silicone.
Whats the plunger gasket made of?

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“Chemically Resistant to: Isopropyl Alcohol, Ethanol, Butane, Hexane, Glycerin, Glycols, Terpenes, and most Acids” this is from the bvv shop page

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They lying.
I know for a fact its not good with d-limonene, one of the major terps in weed.

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i would disagree; tons of people shoot carts in poorly ventilated locations and dont complain. I get where you are coming from tho; as i can be sensitive to “fumes” and smells as well; just not terps.

build yourself a DIY hood if it is really that big of a problem. a long time ago i built something like this for dealing with soldering fumes.
take a large tote take the top off, cut a large portion of one of the sides, cut a 4-6" hole on the bottom, attach ducting and fan and vent outside or into a carbon filter. dont use this ghetto hood with solvents for obvious reasons.

about the best advice i can you other than wearing a full face… which for terps would be way overkill lmaooo

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I would agree with you I had to get a respirator working w carts for a few years I and several others have all noticed effects of mixing carts w terpenes up to 12% and even as low as 4%. I enjoy carts but when mixing I wear a respirator. Why chance it.

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Only trimming does my nose and face get itchy. I’ve filled thousands of carts, zero itchy feeling.

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@Killa12345, this another time it would have been cool if rich had a future account.

Back in the dawn before time, I had to mix true terps Isolates for an absolutely massive operation. Terp day was fucking awful.

The first thing you get is depression. Then comes irritability and memory loss. Smoking weed makes you feel mentally incompetent and you feel like you are dying.

The effects last half a day, and entirely dissapear once over. This is probably with all terpenes though. They evaporate, and you breathe them in. Then u get terp head.

The msds is talking about if you add open flame to the terps. Burning is a chemical reaction, and that reaction creates carbon monoxide and dioxide. Dont terp peoples flowers and you are good.

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I’ve read quite a few articles about terpene degradation products. Just read up on isoprene, the building block of most terpenes. They almost all break down into isoprene before breaking down into other known carcinogens

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I’ve seen the o-rings on a repeater syringe dissolve in terpenes.

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I would not consider BVV to be a legitimate source of information. I have seen the o-rings dissolve on those repeater syringes.

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I have never seem polypropylene or polyethylene dissolve or swell from contact with limonene. I do not believe that compatibility chart. I kept limonene in a 5 gallon polyethylene bucket for several months with no sign of pitting, swelling, or any other degradation, and I kept a watchful eye, having seen that chart myself previous. On the other hand the rubber gaskets used in common syringes will dissolve in no time.

Terpenes 100% will get you high if you inhale enough of them, in the same way that huffing glue, industrial solvents, or other inhalants will. Like those chemicals it will serve as a CNS depressant. If you were to drink a shot of limonene orally the effects would be rapid and severe. That said, in all my days of mixing terpenes i’ve never been exposed in such a way that I got wasted. Safety first kids!

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Like everyone else said…temps too high. Is your material that hot? You are definitely going to start evaporating off light terpenes and it will change the flavor.

I have seen terps react with each other in the bottle and create nasty by products. I will try to get details but I know anything cherry will probably be off the market soon.

I’ve filled more carts than I care to count and never got itchy. Although I get poison ivy every year so itchy is relative.

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What do you mean about cherry being taken “off the market?”

Limonene is hard on your lungs because of the benzene but it surprisingly it’s not as harsh on plastics as one might think. Terpinolene and ocimene would worry me more. They are probably the most savage monoterpene isolates I can think of. Even Myrcene is pretty nasty. Most of the heavier terpene alcohols seem to be less aggressive on plastics as well as benzene formation.

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