I’m under the impression after talks with them that they have something really cool in their hands but don’t know how to sell it because they don’t understand what numbers and data we would need to make an actual ROI sheet
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La Chatlier only really applies to an idealized isentropic (i.e. reversible) system. If you can consider decarboxylation a zero order reaction, which one could make a decent case for, La Chatlier does not apply.
How to test this? Put THCA in a closed vessel, pressurize with CO2, heat rigorously, decarboxylation will still go to completion if you let the reaction run for an “infinite” reaction duration.
edit: my point still being, the pressurization with CO2 does not retard the decarboxylation but rather should increase the rate of carboxylation to such an extent that it outcompetes the much slower decarboxylation rate. Pressurizing with CO2 makes the forward reaction faster, not the backward reaction slower.
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disfavored meaning it’s happening slower, not that it won’t happen
since you’re talking about forward and reverse reactions, that’s by default an equilibrium situation
This reminds me the tough days when I had to sell our enzymes/strains, lol. Cost may vary on scale , raw material cost , facility cost ( if necessary, which usually required since not all companies have enzyme reactors or related equipment, and the major cost of producing enzymes is usually the fermentation process , so it’s really complicated to get numbers to convince buyers , but enzymes are absolutely the new sexy
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Agreed that your not going to be seeing instant decarb and you probably wont see crazy high temps unless certain thermophiles are being used, but you will still see it and be fighting against it in your reaction, its about finding the sweet spot for the enzymes to react, and since high pressure actually helps enzymes increase activity and lowers the affinity for decarb due to higher boiling points for the target molecule it only makes sense that this reaction would be done under pressure for optimal efficiency
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what is the logic here?
How does changing the boiling point affect decarb?
Decarboxylation under Vacuum?
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I’ve been playing with them for the last couple years in my R&D the possibilities are endless
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they have been since they outran catalytic RNA’s…
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Sort of, I can see why you’d put it that way. The force making decarboxylation going forward is not the opposite force making carboxylation go forward. And again, decarb is zero order and the sort of normal chemical equilibria you’re invoking dont necessarily apply. If I were you, I’d think about it as two competing but separate reactions happening for different reasons entirely but that their rates compete with each other. It’s definitely a reaction dynamic, but less of the canonical definition of equilibria.
And again, perform the closed pressurized THCA decarb reaction I described. It effectively blows the la chatlier principle argument away and you can see it with your own two eyes. Pressure will not retard decarboxylation.
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nor will vacuum speed it…
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Place some crude under high pressure and compare the decarb rate next to an open atmosphere vessel 
@eyeworm it dosen’t stop it be it does considerably change the reaction rate
That’s dope. The company I worked for is the earliest one which start enzymatic here in China , but mainly focus on pharmaceutical or nutritional molecules ,I had the chance to communicate or work with the best team in USA like Professor Arnold before she won noble prize ,the bill catalysis team from those BIG pharmaceutical companies . Our R&D team was trying to develop enzymes for cannabinol but probably no progress since everything related to cannabinol are banned. While we did hear companies in USA did great job already
that’s just because you haven’t gotten your solvent out yet…
in order to do that experiment “correctly” we would need to measure the amount of work being done (heat energy applied). from here it seems above my pay grade.
I was asking for the logic. because I don’t understand how it would work.
I also don’t understand how to accurately measure/control the bits what seem to need measured/controlled to actually test your hypothesis.
Edit: mind you, I’m trying to catch up on my homework, and am a couple of hrs deep in Organoleptics: In House QC?
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Sure. At any rate (get it? RATE??) La Chatlier’s principal, if followed to the T, would mean if you put enough CO2 pressure above it that you’ll recarboxylate. You and I both know that is not the case. Decarboxylation is not considered isentropic aka adiabatic reversible in the canonical sense that La Chatlier’s kind of relies upon.
Reaction dynamics are not simple, and perhaps your observation is valid. I don’t think you’re outright incorrect or lacking in understanding of the subject. But either way, I don’t think we’re going to fully define the subject we’re discussing here and now. It would take quite a rigorous kinetic study that ultimately isnt really worth anyone’s time unless we’re trying to publish.
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the vacuum part surprises me more than the pressure tbh.
I stand corrected.
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Vacuum will more quickly rid of your residual solvent and any low boilers that are absorbing collisions that could otherwise provide the required oomf for the molecular discombobulation we refer to as decarboxylation.
Least that’s my take on what the chemists and physicists haz tried to teach me 
…but if enzymes only lower the barrier, and this rxn works in high pressure CO2…
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I’m ready to be proven wrong, I just want to acknowledge the complexity of a true kinetic study of what we’re describing here. I think we’re all thinking of/saying similar things just slightly differently, we’re splitting hairs a little and ultimately this work needs to be done empirically in lieu of a kinetic study (i.e. run a bunch of conditions and just be happy with what conditions work best even though the mechanism is obfuscated).
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Being proven wrong in science means you get new science (or learn new science). I love that shit.
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~starts tying off arm~
“I’m here for the 20 CCs of ‘science’ please!”
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