Thanks for crediting me I really appreciate it! Hope the info helped you and anyone else who got to try it!
I have had this issue when dialing in run times for new biomass lots. With socks, I think the only means of remedy is longer run times. Propane, because of its volatility (high VP/low bp), it likes to channel. Maybe you could try an end of run soak, if that is not too time consuming. In fact I don’t think material socks as they are today are ideal for maximizing yields. In order to prevent channeling the sock material should not be porous along the column length, and open only at the bottom. This way all channeling is “intrasock” instead of bypassing the sock altogether.
I was doing a soak actually. And the yields were quite good. The socks would just get fused to the column side with oil residue. With butane i never had that problem because they’d still be a little “damp” when the run was finished.
I gottcha. My system is unique in that it recirculates the propane without sending it back a solvent collection vessel. The vapor created from heating product collection is recondensed and used to further extract. So there is never a full column of solvent, more of dense vapor and liquid propane in a steady state. I don’t think it is ideal, but it does work well when considering throughput. Of course that is not the only way to run it, but suggested by the OEM.
If anyone in CO needs some propane still have these deodorized bottles for sale:
It is. Are you running IE as well?
No, I’m not.
Any tips on sugar sauce tek ?
Hey what’s up Roji!
One of the original Propane Pioneers!
I remember back on IC Mag when people first started to experiment with propane. This was back in the day when people only wanted stable shatter and anything soft/terpy/crystallized was considered a problem. Back before the crystallization of THCa was widely known about these were some interesting times trying to explain what was happening to our extracts.
I think its was Permacultuure (RIP) who I first saw post something like “Propane extracts all seem to come out super runny, but smell great!”
It was right around that time that I started running fresh frozen and the guy I was working for said “Do whatever you can to get the most terps.”
I started running propane and never looked back.
I’m reviving this thread and tagging some propane heads to help me dial this in. @Slabby @Concentrated_humbold @hashmandu @StoneD @Soxhlet @2terps_roji @Griffin.Labs @Tech1145 sorry for excessive tagging but after reading the propane topics it seems like yall know your pane…
I’m running 100% propane and dialing in my recovery to figure out using a pour spout, consistency has been the issue. I’m not expecting to pour liquid (would if possible but chillers cant hit low enough), I am trying to get a soft foam consistently from the spout. I have gotten portions to come out that way but I mostly get the Styrofoam peanuts/cheese puffs/popcorn which is very hard and dry. It’s a lot of work to get this consistency melted down to a whipable form.
I know about adding butane before recovery, I want to stay 100% pane so I won’t do this. I am trying to keep a light color and not burn terps so a hot melt down isn’t an option either. I have been leaving a lot of solvent in the collection to try to keep the material moist and homogenized but I don’t think it’s working. During “pour” I usually get hard popcorn and later soft foam it seems like maybe thca+ has collected at the bottom and the solvent and terps+ are pooled above that. Could thca+ be falling out of solution, collecting at bottom and drying out even though there is solvent in the collection still? How do I prevent that?
Typically I wash multiple columns into collection and recover between washes, but never recover all the way so there’s solvent with the hash the whole time. Collection temps 80-100° (actual temp probably lower in column jacket). During “pour” I have tried more / less solvent, high / low pressure, raising temp and turning off heat… my experiments haven’t made a clear difference and I have only gotten the soft wet foam at random it seems. Any ideas?
Add a small amount of butane to the collection towards the end of recovery and it’ll help you mitigate your issue. You’re extract will still be a propane extract.
Maybe only 50g.
We typically use 100% pane and can get a good pour if you simply wait for it to warm up before draining. Put a little heat on it. Pressure will rise then it will come out nice and saucy.
So long as there is pressure in the pot, the terpenes will remain in solution (Henry’s law). Vaporized molecules are a gaseous form. Pressure helps keep volatile molecules in solution by forcing the solvent out first.
Otherwise just run 70/30 propane heavy. Then you get a liquid pour every time.
Trying to avoid butane because it will affect post processing
I do this every time, it sits on heat for half hour or more and pressures get to 125-150. I tried pouring at 125 psi yesterday and got the same popcorn then foam results. In my experiments I have recovered from >125psi to different pressures with different temps and haven’t fixed the issue.
We never pour above 25-50 psi, you had too much solvent remaining when you heated it up. Could have bumped it down within range just before pour. Usually helps prevent the spray foam.
That’s caused by solvent decompression to atmosphere making it’s temperature -44c and instantly freezing the crude as it comes out. Think of it as instant freeze drying.
You are after a ratio of more crude to solvent just before you drain. That way when it comes out, the remaining solvent isn’t enough to cause major decompression and the heat retained by the crude maintains the liquid state.
I am saying that I have let it sit for half hour up to 125 psi and then tried pouring at a bunch of different pressures. I recovered to 25-50 psi and saw the same issues.
Once at 25-50 was it stable or keep climbing if you let it sit again? We will pour as low as 15psi, just need enough to push it out. May try overpurge to 0psi then bump some pressure back in to push the final load out once it warms up.
Anything over 50 is pretty much guaranteed to spray foam. If there is too much solvent left during the pour it likes to also cold crash as it comes out at the lower pressure and will spray terp liquid and goop everywhere.
Edit: Could just aim for that result and pour into a bucket so you catch everything. Get terp liquid + cold crash goop all at once.
Pure propane pours can be challenging.
Pour with zero psi. Butane.
If it effects your post processing, learn how to post process. Getting stuck on propane and never learning how to do anything else, isn’t going to get you a versed as you should be.
Also, listen to @Zack_illuminated he’s also giving you excellent info, too.