Hello there,
I am back with a new idea.
Maybe one could seperate trichome from frozen leave more gently by an air jet like in an air jet sieve but cold and vibrating.
That’s it.
What do you think?
Is it worth the effort?
Ice water works well because once the plant material is rehydrated it is not so brittle, making it easier to avoid contaminant.
Dry sift on the other hand is very challenging because the material is very dry and prone to breaking. Thats why processes like static tech and carding are required to clean up dry sift to be full melt.
I imagine cold air would suffer this same problem. What would it offer that dry sifting does not accomplish? Unless you could find some way to use air to separate the trichrome from the contaminant, but static seems much better suited for that.
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For water there is additional microbial contamination risk and the cleaning of cold surface can be easy.
By frozen leave I mean fresh frozen. It is less brittle and has more volatiles.
Maybe if one choses the right geometry for a fluidized bed one can only rub the leaves against each other in the air so the trichomes fall off.
I believe the contamination would be acceptable for further seperation like winnowing in a gravity sifter and electrostatic separation or just the vibrating sieve.
Are there other materials for triboelectrostatic
Would a high voltage supply be needed for that or could the friction caused by particle movement be enough?
Does static even work on fresh frozen trichome contaminant mix?
What about vibrating sifter?
There are many companies that do this!
-CryoMass is a company making equipment for the hemp space,
-The Resinator is the OG commercial cryo dry sifter
- Heck you can just grab a large tank of nitrogen with a dip tube for that teeny bit o LN2 in the tank and use that as a “Cold Breeze + agitation” over your dry sifting screens you’ve got at home!
Dry sifting isn’t that hard, or complicated, it just takes practice and patience, and a solid understanding of your input material and its supply chain.
I wouldn’t recommend learning dry sifting with fresh frozen material to start however.
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I believe cold water and terpene rich trichomes are a critical match in terms of friction and robustness at this temperature.
Can bleeding of the trichome be avoided in such cases - or - how bad can efficiencies get?
I am just thinking theoretically now.
I want to think fresh frozen. It’s fresh.
Is it less brittle in relation to the trichomes at that temperature compared to room temperature dry material brittleness - or - does fresh frozen sieving produce less contamination than classic dry sieving?
Does electrostatic separation work with fresh frozen trichome contaminant mix? With high voltage supply?
For tumblers maybe a cold air knive is helpfull that blows from outside through the sieve to counterwash it, to rub the leaves, to disperse the particles in the air and to push them out of the drum.
This way one could use a refridgeration system to cool everything.
I believe the contamination would be acceptable for electrostatic separation.
Then there are varrious electrostatic fluidized bed seperators that could be operated at freezing temperatures.
Please search for images.
I think for the production of kief simultanious entrainmentaiment and disintegration followed by electrostatic separation could help to reduduce the residual trichome in the spent biomass and decontaminate the kief in comparrison to other disintegration procedures.
Do you think electrifiing the drum to charge the fine particle for subsequent free falling electrostatic fractionation is possible?
I hope to be helpfull.
Pillow case and dry ice, shake shake shake
Then dry sieve to desired micron
Cold sieving was mentioned before but it is not what I meant.
They key in this is to leave out the water, because of microbial contamination and replace it by air for the benefits of elutriation for mass production and quality.
Elutriation usually involves a fluid or gas not air.
I agree with the general consensus, that static to purify dry sift is more worth it. 'cause think of it this way, the cold air hits the material and the pollen has to go through something potentially being trapped in what it’s going through and losing your pollen.
This could work in the way that when the pollen is trapped it could be trapped in a static chamber (that has a viewing glass that’s able to be 360° rotated) that’s calibrated to refine the starting pollen. From there the pollen could go into a chamber that’s coated to make the pollen non-stick to the chamber ensuring minimal loss. That could be an inspection chamber and the input pollen could be held with no static going on in another chamber for inspection.
Could have it simpler with a tumbling aspect have the gears enclosed in a polypropylene casing, turn a chamber with the starting material the pollen tumbles off into a static chamber where you flip a switch and have a smaller tumbling system for the pollen and maybe even movable swiping trays from the outside and you move them up and down like you’d play Foosball so you can direct the pollen different ways while it’s being static pulled.
Idk reinventing the wheel again.
Elutriation is separation effect caused by the interplay of different flow resistances of particles in fluids and another force like inertia or gravity acting on them.
The small particulate contamination on the tricjome also needs to get deagglomerated.
But we don’t whan it in the creek, so whe trap that and recycle that air forever.
Immagine tumble sieving the live kief blowing cold air through it from the top and put in some milling bodies.
After the trichome has separated from top most layer, take it off and keep milling.
Later take out the milling bodies.
Keep sifting.
Do you think heads stalks and dust will separate? The dust has static.
I tell you what. It will get rubbed off and with enough air flow it will elutriate.
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Hmmm on one hand I think you are willing to think outside the box on the other I wonder
If you are really hands on
I use water to decontaminate contaminated material by using hydrogenperoxide in my water
There are more advantages for using water
Than drysieving especially on decontamination
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So you are using a desinfectant to kill microbes you could prevent from growing to a problem in the first place by staying subzero.
Now you’re gonna start giving tek advice to @Roguelab …lol. You’re either a troll or too hard headed to help.
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Thank you all for letting me learn so much!
I am not giving advice.
I am suggesting another route.
have been talking to enough scientists to know how to not give a fuck.
Once you are on this level some might give you answers.
I understand that taking a pass on washing with water seems counterintuitive but when you think biological it makes sense to stay dry or frozen.
ydrogen peroxide
As we know there are seceral pathogens that we need to test for and make sure they are not present on biomass
As stated in the literature.
Hydrogen peroxide is a disinfectant in concentraties of 0.3 % or higher I would recomend adding to the wash water and so disinfecting the biomass at the same time
aricjournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13756-018-0447-5
Effect of Hydrogen Peroxide on E. coli and S. aureus - Journal of Pure and Applied Microbiology
Role of hydroxyl radicals in Escherichia coli killing induced by hydrogen peroxide - PubMed
I won t go in to deep on the matter
But water is your best friend
Not only for cleaning disinfecting
But also in terpene retention color of end product and sheer mass of processing
There are some chemical steps that can be implemented to increase the yields
And extraction times
After this process sifting is important and it is at this point that your idea s make sense
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You lie.
You dry dishes?
Why?
My best friend is a mathematitian.
Water in hash systems causes bacteria to grow.
No water means no live - simple as that.
Water is NOT a disinfectant.
Water dissolves terpenes more than they would evaporate below 0C in a closed loop (loosing only ppm or pm of the total).
Chemical steps to increase the yield.
In bubble hash?
Well you already said that you don’t want to explain.
Color of endproduct is better in comparrison to dry sift wenn you use air dried. Butnot with cold air flow and milling bodies.
Color would be brighter because the debris of leaves get comminuted further and elutriated.
With fresh frozen there are less debris than with dried starting material.
The dust gets rubbed and blown off in the tumble sieve.
I am talking about fresh frozen.
They bleed wenn the get rubbed in water.
So yield is a lie, too.
You can use air like water to fluidize elutriate or entrain you just need some friction or impacts to break trichomes off and into parts.
You know wet shake..
You know sump pits..
You put probiotics to your machine or pray to god your hash doesn’t taste like a salami.
Sir rinsalot the creek is foaming and the idiots must move.
*polishing head
Put a filter.
Duh ! Hydrogen. Peroxide is
Never said air dried !
I am talking about fresh frozen as well
Cut from the field LN2 spray or cO2 snowhorn
Water washing