Buying a sonicator: Hielscher vs. Industrial Sonomechanics

CannaBusiness Vendors
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I don’t know why you are convinced its “modified” coconut oil? He could be truthful with his statements saying he’s not using a (notice the quotations) “modified coconut oil.” While likely using regular coconut oil like most recipes(mine is about 3/4ths coconut oil.) Not saying its the most ethical but yea… the use of quotations modified vs just saying coconut oil makes me skeptical.

For anyone that doesn’t want to pay 1k+ per .2 um filter look up any common water filtration supply. Get a stainless steel housing for a few hundred. And get membranes, if you need a link to the membranes I have 3 different material made membranes that work with oil in water solutions one being the same sonomechanics provides(slightly different pros/cons per textile.) You can buy a 12 pack of 10" membranes for like 700 shipped. Each one will go through 20 gallons but if you do multiple small batches they tend to clog if you let em dry between batches. So you may only get 5-8 thru.

Now if you get an autoclave for 3-5 grand you can clean each membrane 50 fucking times!! My company was paying sono over 1500 every 2 days of production. Now the electricity for the autoclave costs as much as each membrane lol.

Also I have read articles that say the titanium shreds are 650-800 micron so realistically .6 micron filters should do but I can indefinitely say .44 will filter it out it 100 as we did not fail our coas after our test.

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Because that’s what is used by ISE and Axiom, which I’ve used it before, so I know the tells. Plus, coconut oil isn’t a nanoemulsifier, and modified coconut oil isn’t added for emulsion stability.

I could be wrong, but I’m willing to bet dinner I’m not.

I think he’s using quotes to avoid admitting it is modified coconut oil (MCO). But the crazy part is there’s nothing wrong with MCO at all, it’s a fine emulsifier and makes a great end-product for specific uses. It’s just enzymatically modified coconut oil by natural yeast in a bioreactor or from natural enzymes purchased thorough Novazyme and a mixer. It’s not GMO type of “modified.” Its GRAS.

The only reason this matters is there are some big cons to using MCO depending upon the end-product. Something I didn’t learn until I spent north of $2,500 for the MAQ of Goo, when it was still called uGoo. Once I got it and started testing I saw its flaws.

I wouldn’t use MCO personally when there are much better, and cheaper options available, but they require chemistry knowledge and operational experience.

The three big benefits to MCO are that its thermostable, slow to heat up and its a fool proof four step process for <40-50 nm nanoemulsion:
Warm MCO until it’s fuild
Add oil phase while stirring (no more than about 5-6% load)
Add water under high RPM
Sonicate amplitude at 90-110 microns for 45 minutes

Super easy for anyone with enough cash to buy an ultrasonic.

Great advise. I’ve read some of your posts. You know your stuff.

And holy cow they were paying that much! God damn.

I’d suggest looking into a food grade PAA no-rinse flush instead of autoclave if you’re only concerned about the microbes for food safety. Then you don’t pay any electric fees except for your recirc pump. Or, an entry level table-top pressure cooker deigned as an AC works very well as a sterilizer and doesn’t suck up watts like an AC, for less than $1,000 and operates on 120V or 240V (All American makes good ones).

This may work for you?

  • After use rinse capsule filter with DI or pure RO
  • Recirculate fresh PPA at correct % through filter for a few mins
  • Dump filter with only gravity, and then cap to keep moist from evaporating so not dry out
  • Before next use, flush with PAA again and dump with gravity.
  • Filter normal, and dump to waste the first half to full capsule filter volume

Sonomechincas agreed PAA is good for this use when not wanting to use AC. But not many people know of PAA i think.

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https://images.app.goo.gl/tcwnswg6gG9kAvFT7

How much more clear can I be. We are not using anything derive from a coconut. Therefore we are certainly Not using modified coconut oil. Just because Axiom and ISM are using modified coconut oil, it doesn’t mean that we are, and like I said before there’s a reason we are winning former Axiomm and ISM clients. Our formulation is both different and better.

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And on the filtration side of things, we sell 10 inch dual membrane .2 µm filter cartridges that can ensure total sterility with 80 to 100 L of throughput. You are correct that you don’t need to filter down to .2 to get rid of titanium, but you would want to remove bacteria as well, so that’s why we sell the .2.

We also sell a capsule filter with the same high-end .2um membrane that can 5 to 8 L of quality nanoemulsion with a peristaltic pump

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Yeah we would be happy to send you a sample. DM me with your shipping address and tell me what kind of sonicator you have so we can get a feel for minimum batch volume and Processing Throughput

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Sure, and it just happens to exhibit the exact same properties as MCO, comes in the exact same container, and you make the exact same claims, even down to patent pending.

So, how about this to shut me up: What’s the patent pending number?

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We buy our containers from US plastics. You can buy them there too if you want to… How about we let a few people on the forum actually try some free sample of our product, and they can be the judge.
If it’s no good, then they can say so.

Not having tried our product, I don’t think you’re entitled to an opinion on its quality.

For samples, DM me or go to Cannasoltechnologies.com

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And I agree with you. We will Start our own thread. I didn’t mean to hijack this one, But of course,
When falsely maligned, I have to fight back…

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LOL, so it’s no, you won’t share the patent pending number. Yeah, that’s not suspicious at all, and doesn’t lead credence to my position at all
:roll_eyes:

Dude, stop thread jacking. My whole problem with you is you’re acting like a damn spammer. Knock it off.

Why don’t you do what I suggested to you?

Buying a sonicator: Hielscher vs. Industrial Sonomechanics - #80 by anon87263109 suggest you start a thread for you company, and your products. I am not going to post in it. The only reason I came at you hard is you posted like a spammer in two different threads on emulsions. The first two you noticed while scrolling, it seems.

Take some time. Introduce yourself, or starting posting to help people without ulterior motives.

People will forget the drama here.

You will get customers. But just act like other businesses owners are at this fourm.

Also, I am going to report every post of yours in this thread where you hawk you miracle cure with secret ingredients:

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Good. Goodbye and good luck with your business (seriously, good luck).

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Someone has to put an end to this… I’m done responding to High IQ Misanthrope (aptly named)

If anybody wants to try your product, Or if anyone has any questions about ultrasonic cannabis or hemp processing or filtration, I’d be happy to answer them.

We have been at this for over two years, and I am a chemical engineer with a background in pharmaceutical development.

Chances are, if you have a question or are experiencing an issue with ultrasonics/nano, we’ve dealt with the same thing and we might be able to help.

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Right on, im not to familiar with them and stepped away from sono as quick as I could when I found out the 6figure order my boss placed was predominately coconut oil lol. (Dude bought 250k in emulsifier before I got hired :weary:.) If there’s one way I could tell… let me taste that bitter boo boo haha. I can’t wait to see other emulsifiers come into play, if they were interested in r&ding more I gladly would’ve experimented but just wanted a near replica/reverse engineered.

Honestly never heard of PAA myself but definitely going to look into it next time I’m working production. Thanks BTW you as well, extraction manager turned production manager due to contractor issues/lien. Hated it as first and contracts bit me on pay but I got to leave with all the information we learned from pressed pills/vegan gluten free edibles and so on so can’t complain, I got mine.

Yea I started looking into studies on MCO when you mentioned and saw similar ranges in nm, dope!

I always wanted to flush them from the back but my day would always have been way to long after a few batches thru the same filter. It was at start up point and didn’t have much help on labor- long days everyday.

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I am playing with the Heilscher UP400ST and the Stuph nanoemulsifier right now too and work on a final product formulation. The sonicator in combination Stuph emulsifier gets me great nanoemulsions. Very happy. Thank for the recommendation, guys!

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Hi Rowan

Maybe you could help me with a question. I am trying to add some curcumin and piperine extract powder to my cbd mct oil mix. What is the best way to make it stabilize so it’s not gritty and mixes nicely? thank you in advance

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I am very interested. What is in yours?

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Thanks for the info!

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micelles form spontaneously

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We thought the same: “Go cheaper and get some more powerful”. → But in the end, it is like: “you get what you pay for”. So we returned after some experiments to a bigger Hielscher unit. I must say their equipment is real German quality. We have no issues, produce larger quantities of various herbal liposomes and nanoemulsions and get good results. Their team is also always available for help with our new formulations. So if you ask me, I would go for the Hielscher brand again.

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can I ask how it’s going now, a few years later? What are you using as the emulsifier? Are you creating your own or are you purchasing?

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