“They ran into James Morrison, a mass spectrometrist at La Trobe University who Enke knew.”
Australian
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It’s actually a cool ass story. I love the idea of building an incredibly sophisticated and now-ubiquitous piece of analytical equipment basically out of the box of parts
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Selected Ion Fragmentation with a Tandem Quadrupole Mass Spectrometer
Selected Ion Fragmentation with a Tandem Quadrupole Mass Spectrometer.pdf (276.3 KB)
there original paper released 1978 jacs
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this still requires the separation of the species to be ionized.
though the ionization information may be different for different cannabinoids if they all
hit the quadrapole at once wont it become one big jumble of spectra.
I am going to take the evening off to read more on the interpretation of ionized data
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What information are they hoping to gain from this? A triple quad is great for quantitating numerous compounds in a short run time, but don’t really provide an advantage in determining unknowns. If you can’t get a good idea of the structure analyzing the initial fragmentation, the secondary fragmentation isn’t going to help much in solving the puzzle.
Also, is this a triple quad GC or LC?
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Just look into that one that was discussed the other day.
The results shows that using such short run times, both the fancy methods they use here cannot distinguish d8 from d9. The identification is still based on retention time and comparison to certified reference material…
I’ve spent two months in LaTrobe and around. Very nice place. 
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I think the benefit here is not distinguishing d8 and d9 but identifying the other impurities and yields of side reactions. I assumed this was GC triple but maybe I’m mistaken
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Not sure I agree.
So. you identify mystery meat.
its xyz odd isomers.
there’s no info on whether its toxic or cures cancer
identifying D9 is actually relevant,
because it delineates between legal and not legal
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Yeah but this isn’t the right tool for that
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You were right into the topic, and saw it clear.
I would dream to have such fancy tool, especially for improving the identification of the unknown, and ascertaining that of the knowns… which would still need other fancy tools in parallel anyway.
But the main focus of the discussions at the moment are dealing with the d8/d9 analyses. Which is a much more basic topic. And a crucial aspect regarding regulation…
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I suppose I should point out that I get to legally manufacture THC so @rowan 's question is the primary one for me.
I agree absolutely about having access to something like that. I think having even benchtop NMR and a GC/triple would be phenomenal. I posted some links on @Siosis’s lab rant thread, I feel like it could be done with used equipment for less than $100k if you had someone familiar with the setup
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I agree with @Rowan. Why would anyone distribute a mystery soup (compliant or not) that contains greater than 1% of unknowns?
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This is indeed a relevant question. (also relevant to distillates, extracts, tinctures…)
There is in fact one main unknown to be identified in such soup.
And it may be on the verge to be confirmed as d10.
Should also be two other HHCs. Then if done properly, the rest should fall <1% altogether.
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I think it’s good to know what you don’t know. Absolutely
But (JMO) just don’t think it leads to anything of value.
now you know you have some different, (probably) mid transformation isomers - whatcha do with that info?
isolate them and feed them to monkeys obviously! If they make good rock n roll then everything’s good!
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Well this is important to know for the user.
The effects vary a lot depending on the profile.
So far, people experiments of d8 are reporting that d8 has a different effect than d9.
But are they dealing with pure d8 ? or a d8/d9/d10/cbd (+else) mix ?
Not even dealing with the coktail effect with terps and other thing, a cbd:d9 mixture at 1:10 is already not the same as a d9 only products. For instance, so many people report a different experience between traditional (30%d9, 3-5%cbd) and novel (30-40%d9, CBD <1%) Morocan hash.
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Knowledge is power-
If I can tell you exactly what is in my mystery meat… and you can’t tell me what’s in yours…
I will absolutely sell more meat
Also I have a spare GC chassis sitting here so it looks like we’re going to get set up with a GC-FID/MS/MS/MS
Thanks for the open discourse and knowledge sharing folks, this is what the site is all about
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Absolutely 
I’d be for bet’n:
- xyz conversion (eg tosic with isolate) produces the same unknowns every time
- and they are isomers in the process of conversion
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The unknown are generally the same in all the routes discussed on this forum. They just occur in different proportions.
There is a list of at least 30 things, but if reaction is pushed to its limits and done properly, it should end up with a ternary mixture in which remains one main unknown. Likely d10.
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