Have a metals test for this stuff @eyeworm ?
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Most aren’t doing this test yet
I only heard about this because someone who I’ve worked with that makes hhc brought this up to me at bizzcon and he said they didn’t use pd/c, rhodium, or nickle and I asked why he didn’t use pd/c (because that’s what most use to make cbn and it can be used to make hhc) and he told me this
There’s a reason CCL (Colorado chroma labs) is doing heavy metals testing on all there hhc
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I mean i did heavy metals testing on all my CBD isolate… Because i wanted to be able to sell it to every state, but a typical heavy metals test doesnt test for any of those catalysts. are you saying CCL is having theirs tested for more than the standard 4 heavy metals? arsenic cadmium lead and mercury?
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I rarely see HHC sold unless its on here
Locally I haven’t seen it
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Yes, from my understanding they used pd/c at first then started testing for pd and realized 200 ppb was too high to pass for. Since then they’ve started using platinum on carbon and they’re able to pass a platinum test
This was the first time I heard of this at mjbizzcon, CCL and the lab that gave me the sample of hhc i have are the only labs testing for residual hydrogenation metals atm that I know of
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I’ve heard this same rumor but never gave it any credence because no one has described a mechanism by which you could possibly and reasonably distill pure metals over after running common hydrogenation conditions. Metal isn’t “sticking” to a cannabinoid because that isn’t a thing that happens spontaneously in this context - we aren’t creating organometallics under these conditions.
Metals aren’t azeotroping/co-distilling, metal doesn’t get entrained in rising vapor all the way up a short path head, and as far as we are aware no ones distilling cannabinoids in a blast furnace hot enough to vaporize metals. That’s the whole point of using distillation here - metals won’t just spontaneously vaporize and come over. I would be interested to hear what the logic or academic source is behind this claim, anyone I’ve asked directly is kinda like “well this guy or company I trust told me.”
The only way that I can see someone pulling metal over into their distillate is if you outright bumped your boiling flask contents all the way over into your condenser and then kept distilling like nothing happened. It would take that kind of egregious error and deliberate indifference to product quality.
@thesk8nmidget This would not be a standard metals test (mercury, cadmium, lead, arsenic), you’d be testing for metals like palladium, platinum, nickel.
Its not unheard of for a manufacturer to order a superfluous test or create some criteria to give an appearance of legitimacy and then to tell anyone who will believe them “if someone doesn’t get this superfluous test or meet this spec I created then their product is inferior.” Sort of like when you see detergent that’s “10x more color safe than so-and-so.” It seems like a pretty thinly veiled marketing strategy at least as someone who can discern chemical claims.
I’m happy to get the testing done, and I will reach out and order the testing immediately. But again, I would be doing so just to placate what I would consider to be an unsubstantial rumor presumably started by someone else making this product who wants to sell their product/method.
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I don’t think google is the best way to go about that research at this point and time.
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I have our internal data, which suggests that. Also I know what people are buying that aren’t our clients.
I can’t share the data, but I think I am pretty close to being right.
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There’s also a delay in purchase and the time it takes to get to the shelves. From R&D formulation, to taste testing, to label making, you’re looking at a week or three on the low end from purchase to full scale CPG production.
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Can I get a sample of your d10 for testing?
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It’s not a great predictor of what’s about to hit shelves, but it’s certainly good for measuring consumer demand.
Remember, I’m talking search volume, here.
Not results.
I’m not so sure, I think this could happen during WFE.
Isn’t Mercury purified by distillation?
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Without dwelling on this since it doesn’t really apply to my process - I don’t use a WFE - metal isn’t spontaneously forming organometallic species and co-distilling. If there was a mechanism for metal contamination it would be mechanical/cross contamination in some way (bumping a your boiling flask into your short path’s condenser somehow, having a wiper whip some of the feedstock onto the cold finger of a WFE). It would not be a situation where the metals we’re talking about vaporized and condensed i.e. co-distilled.
As far as mercury, sure - with the right equipment and deliberately attempting to distill the metal. We aren’t really talking about mercury here, and that would be something I would expect to see tested for on the COA for the CBD isolate purchased upstream. But mercury also has a boiling point much higher than any cannabinoid. So again that wouldn’t be particularly relevant unless I was distilling cannabinoids at like 250-350C, or if I expected there to be mercury in the starting material. For all intensive and realistic purposes, you aren’t distilling over mercury under these conditions in a short path.
For what it’s worth, it doesn’t bother me that these questions are being raise - I think this level of due diligence and scrutiny is fine. But at the same time I am hoping to cut through some of conjecture as very unlikely if not entirely unsound at its foundation. If anyone wants to reach out for samples and actually try (or test) the product I would love to get the product in front of more people, but its a little unsettling having doubt casted on my product on such an unfirm basis, yaknow?
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Competitors will do just about anything to slow traction to their comp. From misinformation campaigns to totally false claims about their process to send the potential competitors on a wild goose chase in the wrong direction.
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That’s what I was thinking about.
For the record, I think it is unlikely that a Pd atom “coordinates” with a cannabinoid molecule and survives the short path straight-shot journey from evaporator surface to condenser finger under molecular distillation conditions.
I sincerely hope you don’t count me as belonging to that cohort.
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No of course not. I always appreciate your input.
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It’s even more unsettling you’ve heard about this and never spent the time to actually prove it wrong when you can
We’re talking about a 200 dollar test maybe?
Idk I’d have done the test to prove ppl wrong
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I’d argue cbn is #3
Even with the current hhc spike it’s price is gonna crash faster imo
CBD, d8, CBN, d10 (facing an obvious slow down), HHC
Even cbg production is also underestimated by me.
Being a non THC but known to get people high, on paper the sky is the limit. We’ll see.
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I don’t test the air I breath for things I know aren’t in it either. When I hear that nonchemists somewhere are worried about something that doesn’t have a basis I don’t run out and spend resources to assuage baseless conjecture.
It is not $200 to have a unique elemental analysis performed. The standards alone cost more than that. If I can find a lab that specifically has the ability to test for those metals already, I still expect to pay the better part of $500. But if I’m paying a lab on contract to perform method development work on elements they don’t usually analyze? That is not $200.
Edit: more to the point, I already said above I’m amenable to getting the testing done, but again it’s only to ease the minds of folks who don’t understand that it actually isn’t a legitimate concern.
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I would hope CBN takes bronze.
HHC will stand a better chance once the active diastereomer is the only one produced, in my opinion.
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