Decarb under pressure to retain terps?

Wow, @borysses ! Your recent posts here are PURE GOLD! You’re very kind to share your wisdom on the subject! I can tell you’ve actually done this before! :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

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Don’t let me started on polar cannabinoids :smiley:

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Please do it

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Yeah, @borysses! Please feel free to speak your mind on anything you want… certainly, I am happy to read and respond to it! It is not every day that I see such interesting topics and ideas come up, so I appreciate it! :nerd_face:

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We should definitely start a new thread if there isn’t already one on it.

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Because: cross-link :shushing_face:

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Because: maths

Note that it’s wrong.

The all knowing one gave me the MW for THC when asked for THCa, and I was too dumb to notice it.

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This calculator makes it pretty easy for dead reckoning.

1000g of THCa=127g CO2
127g/44.01g/mol= 2.885mol of CO2
2.885mol@100C in 10L headspace= 8.833atm or 129.8psi

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Yep. Dey da bomb fo sure…



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@AlexSiegel These devices look okay to use… worlds better than decarbing in sealed glass jars like you were telling me someone was touting the other day!

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They do look decent. For small scale operators I think vacuum would be less risky but if the equipment is purpose built, it should be fine.

Pressure relief valves > mason jar lids popping off.

I think the decarb in a sealed jar technique has been spread farther than I previously thought. It’s an accident waiting to happen especially when operators try to scale up the concept.

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Just condense your terps back into the boiling flask. Same idea as trying to retain your volatile reagents under reflux during Fischer esterification. Carboxyl group isn’t going to spontaneously reattach itself to your THC and the terpenes will come right back down. Problem solved.

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Everyone has been overthinking it. There’s my free tech.

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Indeed, @AlexSiegel, and YES @MassTerpenes! This is certainly the way I’ve done it… albeit with a modular system of opposed electro-acoustic oscillators* driving the water-cooled proximal end of the liquid helium compression chamber chilling the distal cold head to about 77K (-321°F / -196°C) facing vertically downward and attached to the 9" heat sink I formed from strips of aluminum to make a thermal gradient coldfinger condenser clipped inside a small well trap to catch any droplets that didn’t freeze solid. :thinking: This was back in 2015, but I’ll bet that unit would work splendidly in a 3" tri-clamp opening in the center of the lid on one of these pressure pots… Ooh, especially with a thermos clipped over the heat sink! Do you think I could play with one of those @cyclopath?

*think “two piston-like speakers pushing sound waves into each other at close range” I.e., at controlled frequency to rapidly compress and decompress a sealed well of pure helium, where the amplitude is static and frequency modulates the temperature of the metal end of the well (cold head) being chilled by the repeated evaporation of the liquid helium inside it, which is reliquified by the pressure (assisted by water cooling above it removing latent heat of condensation).

Sure, it’s overthunk… but it gets the job done when the only gas/vapor I don’t mind circum"venting" condensation is CO2. (The pun insisted.)

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The shortage of liquid helium for superconductors (think NMR) is drastic. I don’t see an industry popping up using it for decarbing.

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As per @anon64373531 comment with Helium already being short in supply let alone pure liquid helium, is it necessary to use instead of say cold water, chiller fluid, or some combination? I have no doubt using the helium in the condenser obtains the best results. Probably also to consider is the overall length of the condenser with respect to the set mantle temperature.

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I genuinely appreciate your understanding of the circumstances surrounding Earth’s preciously limited helium resource @anon64373531 & @406_Chemabis, and I commend you both for speaking up on the matter (or lack thereof… sorry, insistent pun)!! Thank you!

That said, please rest assured that this is a hermetically sealed system containing a specific and finite quantity of UHP helium… and nary a mole at that! Although helium is among the most ephemeral of elements on Earth, and a peerless penetrant among all atoms which inevitably requires refilling in any receptacle, the mass inside my machine is maybe a mere mole at most; 3 going on 4 grams, give or get a centigram… and Godness graciously, the ghost of noble gas has miraculously maintained over minimum operating pressure, these past 7 years! :crossed_fingers:

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You’re not pulling vacuum so I don’t see the need to get too crazy with the condensing power. Keep in mind when you use this setup during fisher esterification you’re working with volatiles like methanol, ethyl acetate, short chain carboxylic acids, etc. The reaction itself would not work if those were all gassing off past the condenser into the fume hood. That’s not to say I don’t have my share of dumb ideas to cool things more but those all require a complete disregard for the correct way of using lab glass, so I’ll keep those ideas in the DM’s for now.

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Would you be continuously flushing the system with an inert gas then? I don’t see how there wouldn’t be any unwanted side reactions occurring with respect to the terpenes and other VOC’s if ambient air/oxygen isn’t taken into consideration.

Definitely will be reaching out to hear more *crazy ideas *

Anyone ever consider using a CO2 membrane to allow CO2 to escape the decarb chamber but nothing else?

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Hi danny,

Im trying to decarb 2000 grams of oil @ 80c. I have 8L of headspace , i did the PRV calc and ill be under my rated 350 PSI rating. The only info i cant find is how long it will take at 80c v 90c v 100 c i cant seem to figure that out

can you help me