Chiller help, please. Trying to match ethanol chilling to extractor capabilities.

Hello,

I’m now setting up a new lab in South America and am speaking with both USA/EU/China suppliers. Each one has a different chilling option and I don’t know who to trust. e.g. I’ve gone through a long discussion about the systems and learn late in the talk that one option uses LN3, said as if that was no big deal, then telling me its 1:1 ratio, so, yeah, I’d need to put a 3000L to 5000L tank of LN3 outside my building… Can’t happen, I can only use electrical (but I got that in spades - 220V to 480V, 1 and 3 phase, 50hz in the facility).

We will have a centrifuge extractor system, with 20kg to 25kg bags of material. We will play with ethanol levels, but I’m going to start with 1:6 ratio, so c. 150L of ethanol needed down to -40C to -60C. The extractor specs say a run is anywhere from 20-40min. So the salespeople are telling that the system can do 2 runs per hour. But I don’t believe their chillers can do 150L of ethanol down to -40C every 30min so I can keep up with the extractor. And if I need 1:8 ratio, that is 200L.

I’m playing with the idea of using the ethanol twice as well - same 200L ethanol used for two bags. Either looping back, or maybe we will buy two extractors and run in-line or ??? For that a jacketed extractor or vessel would probably be needed to keep ethanol cool during the run and into the next machine/run.

I went to a refrigeration specialty company (not in industry, they just make refrigeration and chilling units) and they proposed a 4 ton system for $170,000 as opposed to the $40k to $60k the suppliers are talking about for their systems.

Help me understand my chilling options better, if you can. 200L/hr down to -40C to -60C from ambient would work for our needs now, but still not keep pace with the extractor (in case we grow a bit and could use its capacity fully).

Thank you!

There are several options
First How much ethanol may you have on site ?
Pre freezing etho in a walk in freezer is a good start
Chinees chillers are not so good and
Most here are happy with cryodax chillers

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Pre-chilling to -20c in a walk-in freezer is going to be the most economical option rather than trying to get it all down to -40c from room temp. I’d definitely go with using the same ethanol twice before recovering, but do a particle filtration first so you don’t have biomass particles sitting in the ethanol for too long. I’ve seen some say they use the same ethanol as much as 3x, but I would worry about saturating the ethanol too much at those temps. All the chillers I have seen at the size you’re talking about that are in the $40-60k range use Ln2. What country are you in?

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That’s really common. I think you should buy a slightly larger chiller than you need. It would be better to spend a little more money on chillers than to find out your chillers are heating up due to your recovery system transferring heat to your chillers.

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You need a two stage chiller that is beefy. We have one that can do 150-200gal/hr from room temp down to -40.

Check your DM’s for pricing pdf:

https://www.instagram.com/gps_llc/

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I need to calc the pre-freezing out a bit. Buying a walk-in freezer and running it 24/7 vs. just cooling what we need, when we need it is the question.

Yes, we have an in=line filter setup between the two extractors.

Uruguay.

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Ahh, Uruguay. Beautiful country, that’s where I learned to surf in Punta del Diablo. I need to make my way back there sometime and check out how the cannabis industry doing now that my Spanish is much better than it was back then.

The freezers ended up making more sense to us because we’re planning on using liquid nitrogen to chill to -40, so it reduced the cost of Ln2. We also figured it would make more sense if we were to upgrade to an electric chiller to reduce the load on it, making it possible to use a less expensive chiller.

One drawback is ensuring the employees re-stock the freezer before going home or else your following work day is kinda screwed if you don’t have access to Ln2 and you have to rely on a smaller electric chiller. If you have a large enough freezer though, that’s rarely a concern as you can just store much more ethanol than you need daily and dip into the reserve supply that’s already cold.

Try our Direct Refridgeration solution. We have yet to see anyone beat our times. LN2 is not realistic if you plan to actually process 24/7. We literally developed our solution because nobody had a chiller that would pass c1d1/d2 certs. Most solutions just have a regular non-explosion proof chiller circulating ETOH in and out of the control area. Completely not safe and illegal. We get the heat out of the control area by locating the compressors outside. We also make -40 freezers etc.

Website?

perma.cool or on IG @perma_cooling
We manufacture a number of chillers specifically for ETOH chilling.

PERMACOOL - your chillers aren’t class 1 div 2 rated like you claim they are. Get outta here. Get the required ratings for use with ETOH then sell your product.

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